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Rlowenote
Akahai
84 Posts |
 Posted - 01/29/2006 : 4:07:29 PM
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Playing something "extra" fast (too fast) sounds like something out of the "Inner Game of Music" book. I have found that it can help when you go back to "normal" speed. We've done that very thing in a Mandolin Orchestra practice. Repeating a section over and over increasing the tempo as people would drop out. When we went back to standard tempo, more people were able to play the section than before. I'm not advocating playing everything fast all the time, but only as another tool to help one improve. Also playing something you know extra slow can be harder than playing at normal speed.
Ralph |
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Karl Monetti
`Olu`olu
USA
756 Posts |
Posted - 01/29/2006 : 8:13:26 PM
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Ralph,
As i mentioned before, it's not for eveyone but it works for me, too. Sometiimes |
Karl
Frozen North |
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Mika ele
Ha`aha`a
USA
1493 Posts |
Posted - 02/10/2006 : 2:10:54 PM
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I once took a guitar workshop/clinic (I think it was Chris Proctor or Doyle Dykes) and he said to play with a metronome and slow it down until you can play each digestible section with NO MISTAKES three times through in one setting. Then bump the speed up a notch and keep practicing until you can play it cleanly and evenly with NO MISTAKES three times through again in one setting. Keep doing that until you can play the enitire piece a little above concert tempo. Then when you slow down and play for performance your mind knows you can play it faster with no mistakes so you are more relaxed and you MAKE NO MISTAKES.
When I do this religiously, it works for me . . usually . . unless beer is involved.  |
E nana, e ho'olohe. E pa'a ka waha, e hana ka lima. |
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ki haole
Aloha
USA
2 Posts |
Posted - 05/31/2006 : 10:56:12 AM
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Interesting how much overlap there is on this topic.
First of all, I appreciate the whole conversation about playing things smoothly, slowly, as fast as you can, etc. I know I try to play things too fast too early, and sometimes later, when I try to slow them down, I can't play them at all. This indicates to me that I don't really know the piece at all - it's just reflexes, which can't be good. One of my many, many books on guitar playing advises that you "Practice as slowly as necessary to play without mistakes, and perform as quickly as possible without making mistakes." Sounds like the same thing, but I suspect it isn't. Can't really say, though, since I never seem to be able to do either without mistakes.
Most of my tunes were learned from Hanson's "Masters of Slack Key", Beamer's "Teaches Slack Key", and Ozzies "Hawaiian Style" (which I just started working in).
My repertoire (in approximate order of "mastery")
Tunes from Memory:
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Moe 'Uhane
Mino'aka
Kani Ki Ho'alu
Manuela Boy
La Paloma
Spouting Horn (can't believe nobody else listed this one - I love it!)
Tunes still requiring Tab:
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Isa Lei
He Punahele (from the Beamer video, nylon strings only!)
'Awiwi
Maunaloa
Manamana 'Lele
Ho'omalu Slack Key
Punahele (at half tempo, on a good day)
Wish List:
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Ozzie's Ku'u Kika Kahiko (where can I get tab for this?)
Keola's Ku'u Lei Awapuhi Melemele
Hilo One (as performed by Patrick Landeza - searching for tab here too)
I need to work on the non-TP tunes in Ozzie's book, but so far I'm too lazy to retune and the early tunes still need work, so that's where I stop when running through that book.
Any suggestions on other tunes that would fit my list?
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Reid
Ha`aha`a
Andorra
1526 Posts |
Posted - 05/31/2006 : 3:10:10 PM
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Aloha no e Bob,
I am surprised that you can charge through "Spouting Horn" (which I find unHawaiian) and still need tab for "Ho`omalu Slack Key". The latter is so logical (alternating Gs and Ds) and variations built on simple 3rds on one string, that it is instantaneously memorizable, not to say beautiful sounding, which it is. And, it is in the same vein as "Moe Uhane".
From the others in your list, it seems that they are of differing substyles and differing levels of difficulty.
I have a suggestion: maybe stop trying to get those songs under your fingers immediately (it looks kinda like you are trying to get a hit list) and look at them and think about their structure a bit. Thinking never hurt anyone, and I don't mean to imply that you aren't good or that you are superficial. I am sure that you are better than I am: everyone is. Just slow down and understand what you are doing. Search on this site for all the discussion on `Awiwi. That song is DEEP. Punahele in that book is a version of a piece that has had decades of development. Look into it.
Good Luck,
Reid |
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Lawrence
Ha`aha`a
USA
1597 Posts |
Posted - 05/31/2006 : 5:24:02 PM
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quote:
"Spouting Horn" (which I find unHawaiian)
Mark Hanson has never claimed Spouting Horn was "Hawaiian", but that
it was inspired by Hawaiian stylings (which it is). (Read the CD
Label) It is a beautful tune nonetheless. Personally I do not find it
to be any LESS Hawaiian than Kipahulu (by Jeff Rassmusen) or Kaopuiki
Aloha (by Barry Flanagan) or several of the tunes on last years
Hawaiian Grammy winning CD by Michael Brotman, or any of the Hundreds
of LA-written Hapa-Haole tunes not to mention all the Reggae stuff
currently popular in Hawaii. If Spouting Horn happens to become part
of the "standard" Hawaiian repertorie, then fine by me.
Mark was trying to honor the folks he had studied Hawaiian Music with
and still do something that was clearly his original and not just a
cheap copy made of stolen phrases and turnarounds. This is exactly
what Cyril and Dennis and George and Ozzie and my other Hawaiian
teachers tell me should be done.
I have studied under many teachers, and for me Mark H. is the best
Musician and Music Teacher of any I have had. (better even that
Ozzie - who you must admit, is very hard to beat) He is academically
trained in Music, has perfect hearing and is highly skilled at the
guitar as well.
And he has written some dammed good tunes too. 
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Mahope Kākou...
...El Lorenzo de Ondas Sonoras |
Edited by - Lawrence on 05/31/2006 5:35:37 PM |
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kihoalukid
Lokahi
USA
289 Posts |
Posted - 05/31/2006 : 7:22:52 PM
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| Dont forget, Ray Kane liked Spouting Horn enough to claim it would make Mark "thousands" :-) |
Lee |
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Reid
Ha`aha`a
Andorra
1526 Posts |
Posted - 06/01/2006 : 03:13:47 AM
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Hey guys...De Gustibus, right? And I admire Hanson as much as anyone. Besides, that was not the thrust of my post.
...Reid |
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ki haole
Aloha
USA
2 Posts |
Posted - 06/01/2006 : 06:33:04 AM
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Reid:
Thanks for taking the time to respond to my post. As far as why I don't need tab for Spouting Horn, but still do for Ho'omalu, it's just a matter of the amount of time I've put into the latter. I simply haven't worked on it enough to memorize all the variations yet. I agree with you about the progression and form - very logical and so similar to Moe 'Uhane, which is what drew me to it. However, I do appreciate the form of Spouting Horn as well - I spend most of my time attempting to play jazz, and this reminds me more of a jazz tune with a Hawaiian flavor. I like it BECAUSE it is so different. Hanson has done what I aspire to with this tune - which is (as Lawrence stated so well) to assimilate the music and produce a truly original work that neither appropriates from nor mimics the pieces that inspire it. That's my opinion, anyway - I'm certainly not an expert or historian with regard to Hawaiian music (I'm just a middle-aged white guy in the corn belt, after all).
Oh - by the way, just because I've memorized it doesn't mean I can "blow through it" by any means. Notice it was at the bottom of the "mastery" list.
I guess my goal here is to build a vocabulary - to expose myself to as much diverse, enjoyable, playable music as I can, and to eventually absorb enough to improvise a little, and maybe have slack key influences in my jazz improv and/or composition. I'm never going to "do justice" to slack key the way someone who grew up with it can.
I will look into the 'Awiwi discussions - I'm not sure I completely understand what you're trying to tell me about appreciating the form. I'm not sure what I said that would lead you to believe that I don't already understand and/or appreciate the form.... But I've only been at this for a year or two, so there's certainly still tons I need to learn. And with a lack of teachers in the area, there's only so much one can learn from books.
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Edited by - ki haole on 06/01/2006 07:08:01 AM |
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Reid
Ha`aha`a
Andorra
1526 Posts |
Posted - 06/01/2006 : 07:26:43 AM
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Bob, with this additional information, it has become apparent that you have the approach exactly right: it is essential to acquire the "vocabulary". The perfect word.
...Reid |
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kihoalukid
Lokahi
USA
289 Posts |
Posted - 06/01/2006 : 08:53:38 AM
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| Reid, i just liked that story bout Uncle Ray, thats all. Learned a new word too (De Gustibus). |
Lee |
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Mika ele
Ha`aha`a
USA
1493 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2006 : 4:02:44 PM
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Menpachi Man,
You crack me up Dude! Happy Fourth of July! |
E nana, e ho'olohe. E pa'a ka waha, e hana ka lima. |
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Menpachi Man
Lokahi
274 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2006 : 4:29:44 PM
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Mika'ele
I stay teach one guy on da Big Isle wen I go home. I stay tell 'em da same ting. Slow down until NO MISTAKES. An' no mo da bass, hoooh all hemajang. I tell 'em, yu gotta make shuah got da bass oddah wize all junk. But he can sing and play ukulele. Me, I no can chew gum and run so no can play and sing. Oneh can play guitah liddo bit.
Happy 4th!
Mahalos! |
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Mika ele
Ha`aha`a
USA
1493 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2006 : 8:41:36 PM
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| I like to say I can either play well or sing well but not both at the same time -- but that is still stretching the truth. |
E nana, e ho'olohe. E pa'a ka waha, e hana ka lima. |
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Menpachi Man
Lokahi
274 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2006 : 4:25:35 PM
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| U real luckeh man. Me, wen I sing. Everybodeh run away! Ah, but get good fun. Oneh backyard kine stuff. |
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