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Julie H
Ha`aha`a
USA
1206 Posts |
 Posted - 12/25/2007 : 10:37:04 PM
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I bought a fabulous 1935 or so Rickenbacher (long scale) Fry Pan on eBay, and with it there was a steel bar, but it was somewhat conical in shape, thicker at the base and tapered toward the tip. I've never seen one like that. Does anyone have any information about it?
Julie
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Edited by - Julie H on 12/26/2007 8:15:47 PM |
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thumbstruck
Ahonui
USA
2168 Posts |
Posted - 12/27/2007 : 06:43:02 AM
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| Slipry1 has an old vintage ceramic bar that slightly tapers. He'd know more about it. |
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wdf
Ha`aha`a
USA
1153 Posts |
Posted - 12/27/2007 : 07:27:08 AM
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Julie,
The place to ask is over at the IGS guitar forum. Bob Brozman is a regular contributor. I'm sure someone there would know.
Here is a link to the forum.
Cheers.
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Dusty |
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justplainbill
Akahai
USA
53 Posts |
Posted - 01/01/2008 : 1:00:06 PM
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Bobby Ingano used one for a while. I had one re-chromed for him last year, but it didn't turn out very good. The material was pot-metal, like used for door handles and window cranks in cars. It turned out sort of wavy and uneven (??)
The long scale frypan has to be the greatest sounding of all the frypans made. Mine is a short scale 7 string, and just doesn't sound as good as a long scale.
Bobby Ingano is now playing a long scale that I refurbished for him last summer. He sez it sounds great, which is good to hear! |
Edited by - justplainbill on 01/01/2008 1:27:46 PM |
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hapakid
Luna Ho`omalu
USA
1533 Posts |
Posted - 01/01/2008 : 2:27:32 PM
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I use a light conical bar with the brand "Chase" stamped on the end. It gives me a small tip for single string work and a wider end for my palm to grasp. I found it in a pawn shop. I also have a medium Ernie Ball that sounds great, but is slower to pick up because it's so heavy.
Jesse Tinsley |
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noeau
Ha`aha`a
USA
1105 Posts |
Posted - 01/01/2008 : 3:17:20 PM
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| Jerry Bird recommended a Dunlop 918 I think or a 919 depending on whether you played a six string or an eight string guitar. The weight is minimal I suppose but it was about the length of the bar to cover six strings or eight strings. The bar is rarely picked up. The back end is sometimes lifted for the Ptah move but Jerry taught that the bar is never lifted . The idea is to mute and slide from position to position. And the bar is delicately placed between thumb and index and middle finger. Not the palm per se. The ring finger and pinky rest across the strings to provide a sort of mute to keep the strings from zinging when the bar is moved up and down the neck. Chords changes are accomplished by muting the strings at times with the right hand edge unless a slide or slur is intended. |
No'eau, eia au he mea pa'ani wale nō. |
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hapakid
Luna Ho`omalu
USA
1533 Posts |
Posted - 01/02/2008 : 1:52:43 PM
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It looks like Byrd used a medium bullet slide from the videos I've seen. I've got one, but it's easier to play Sol Ho'opi'i style with the small conical bullet, unless you have a Shubb-style steel. The conical shape allows you to maintain a better hold on it by giving you a bit more purchase on the middle of the steel so you can pull it into your palm for more stability.
Jesse |
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justplainbill
Akahai
USA
53 Posts |
Posted - 01/02/2008 : 2:04:21 PM
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Jerry used to write little articles in the HSGA news letter, and if I remember correctly, he recommended a 3/4 X 2 2/4 tone bar. Anyone have his guitar course? I think he sez that in his course also.
Some of the new (expensive!) tone bars made of Delrin are easier to hang on to. Thought about getting one, but I'm too set in my ways, and too stubborn. |
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cmdrpiffle
`Olu`olu
USA
553 Posts |
Posted - 01/30/2008 : 1:49:30 PM
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Julie, you need the Brozomatic, not actually conical, indented end and round tip. Heavy polished steel. You can usually get them at Union Grove Music on Pacific Ave.
Cheers |
my Poodle is smarter than your honor student |
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Julie H
Ha`aha`a
USA
1206 Posts |
Posted - 01/30/2008 : 8:52:08 PM
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Well, Bob calls it a Brozophonic, but I've had difficulty finding it. The tip of it is slightly elongated compared to the other bars, and it doesn't have this little edge I have on my old one. I will still keep looking for it, and I will go to Union Grove. Thanks Mr. Piff Commander sir.
Will I see you there? 
Julie |
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slipry1
Ha`aha`a
USA
1511 Posts |
Posted - 01/31/2008 : 4:33:43 PM
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| On the advice of Alan Akaka, I switched from my heavy duty pedal steel bar to a medium one, which seemed to be used by most of the steel players I met or saw in Hawaii. Jim Dunlop has a Jerry Byrd model that I like. |
keaka |
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cmdrpiffle
`Olu`olu
USA
553 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2008 : 08:45:23 AM
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Hey Julie,
Sorry, yeah it's a Bronz o Phonic. My bad. I picked mine up there some years ago. (runined it by trying to sand it smoother, and now it's useless as a slide)
I know Elderly has it, plus a pretty good selection of others.
I think it was Dusty who mentioned it, but I'd recommend, above all others, Ian McWees Diamond slides. www.diamondbottlenecks.com hand made glass, heavy leaded crystal glass, beautiful, customized, and he'll even cut your name in it. Not cheap, usually around $50.00 USD, but well well worth it.
Maybe see you there! You still hanging out at UKE NIGHT at Bocci's on Thursdays?
Cheers,
Mike |
my Poodle is smarter than your honor student |
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kamalu70
Aloha
USA
18 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2008 : 12:59:39 PM
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Aloha kakou,
Haven't been in the taro patch for a long time. Nice to see it is still going strong and has expanded its scope somewhat. Just some comments on the conical bars for steel playing. I believe these bars were introduced as a more ergonomic alternative to straight bars. Because of the larger diameter of the back side, you wouldn't have to bend your hand upwards at the wrist so much when the bar is on the strings. This makes for a more natural and comfortable position in regards to your bar hand. If you play a table steel with legs, the same effect can be attained by adjusting the legs so that the front edge of the steel (the edge away from you in playing position) is slightly lower than the back edge. I've seen the great Hawaiian steel player Casey Olsen with his single-neck table steel set up like that. A lot of lap steel players (not necessarily Hawaiian players) seek out the vintage "Black Rajah" bar. It was a conical bar of metal covered in black bakelite plastic, first made in the 1930s I believe. Why this bar has almost legendary status among some players is beyond me. I've never been partial to bakelite bars, but everytime one comes up on eBay, it brings on a bidding war and ultimately an absurdly high winning bid.
When I first started teaching myself how to play Hawaiian steel in the early 1970s, I had the guitar...which by coincidence was also a long-scale Rick frypan, but no steel bar. The only place I could find one in Honolulu was at Harry's Music in Kaimuki. The one I got was cone-shaped, chrome-plated with a black plastic cap on the back end, and came in a black vinyl pouch. I bought it cause I didn't know any better. It was hollow and fairly light-weight and because of that, easy and fast to maneuver. Years later I saw an old video of Feet Rogers playing with the exact same or very similar bar. I used that bar for about 2 years, playing in high bass A tuning, and wore out my collection of Sons of Hawaii vinyl records, learning the licks of Feet Rogers. Then I enrolled in a Hawaiian steel class at the Hawaiian Music Foundation's halau mele because they were teaching C6 and B11 tunings. Jerry Byrd was a teacher there, but he wasn't teaching my class. One nite he did drop into our class, just to check it out I guess. When the class was over he came up to me, stuck his hand in his pocket and pulled out this really short, straight bullet bar. "Here," he told me as he put it in my hand, "this is what you need." Then he told me a little about his theory on short bars and why he preferred them. I started using his bar and never looked back. It totally works for me, and I play six, seven and eight-string steels. It's small size makes it very maneuverable, yet it has the weight for more sustain, unlike the hollow, conical bar I was using. At the time Jerry gave me the bar, I believe he was having all his bars custom made. Seems to be made out of stainless steel. The size of it is very close to the Jerry Byrd model now manufactured by Dunlop, except the nose end has a slightly flatter profile, and the concave in the butt end was painted blue. I've tried all kinds of bars since then. The Broz-O-Matic is just too long for me. Brattain Guitar Products makes a line of bars called "Red Rajah" that are coated with some material that makes them slick on the strings but not slippery in your fingers. They come in straight and conical shapes and a variety of different styles. I have a couple of them and they feel and work good, but I don't know how long the coating will last. Anyway, I keep coming back to my JB bars. I use the ones made by Dunlop now. The original, custom made one that Jerry gave me years ago just sits up on a shelf. Wouldn't want to lose or damage such a sentimental momento.
aloha,
kamalu |
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kamalu70
Aloha
USA
18 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2008 : 1:04:20 PM
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Me again...sorry, made the same mistake. Bob Brozman's bar is called the "Broz-O-Phonic," not "Broz-O-Matic."
kamalu |
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justplainbill
Akahai
USA
53 Posts |
Posted - 02/06/2008 : 06:49:20 AM
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| I'm also still using the JB 2 3/4 inch bar. Tried some others, like the black pheonix etc, but always went back to the JB type. I believe the round bar is what a student should use right from the start, and not have to get familiar with after using other types. |
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