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Slackkeygirl
Aloha
USA
5 Posts |
 Posted - 09/12/2005 : 2:53:34 PM
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Hi. I'm new to slack key guitar and am working on some exercises in Ozzie's "Guitar Playing Hawaiian Style." In a number of the exercises - e.g. #3 and #6 - the following type of hammer and pull off is required on the high E string (G tuning): 0^5^0 and 0^12^0. Whenver I do it, I get overtones from the frets immediate above the one being hammered on. For example, when I do the 0^5^0, I get overtones from the 6th fret note. Similarly, when I do the 0^12^0, I hear the note at the 13th fret. This happens on several of my guitars, and neither muting nor slightly varying the position of my fretting finger seems to make a difference. What am I doing wrong?
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Ray Sowders
Akahai
USA
96 Posts |
Posted - 09/12/2005 : 3:49:11 PM
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Aloha Slack Key Girl,
Your probably not doing anything wrong. I think you will find that the "overtones" you hear are from the string you are playing. I know you are doing a hammering technique, but try the following experiment. Place your left finger on the highest string, 12 fret push it down and hold it. Play the string with your right hand in the normal picking position, above the sound hole...sounds normal right? Keep the string pushed down, and take your right hand to the opposite end of the neck, down by the nut (the end toward the tuning keys) and pick the same string from that end, say around the 2nd fret. Does that sound like the other note your hearing when you hammer on the 12th fret? Probably. Do the same thing on the 5th fret. Remember to keep the sting pushed down, and keep your left hand where it is. (Does this make any sense to you?) I think the note your hearing is the sound of the string automatically ringing from the "other end". You need to just play throught the hammer. Play as if you don't hear the other note. This overtone is only heard while the sting is pressed down. A hammer is a string played open, pressed down, and pulled off. Try not holding your "pressed down" section quite so long. Hope this helps, let me know if your totally confused. It's something that takes longer to explain in writting then it would just to show you. Keep at it, we need more female slack key guitar players.
Aloha Pumehana, Ray Sowders |
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Mika ele
Ha`aha`a
USA
1493 Posts |
Posted - 09/12/2005 : 4:46:28 PM
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Diana,
You might want to get together with "pua kai" - Nancy. She lives in the LA coastal area and is getting pretty good at this slack key stuff. She is very supportive. (And getting help from Ray is not bad either) |
E nana, e ho'olohe. E pa'a ka waha, e hana ka lima. |
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Slackkeygirl
Aloha
USA
5 Posts |
Posted - 09/12/2005 : 6:58:27 PM
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| Ray thanks for taking the time to respond to my concern. I tried your experiment and the result is exactly as you outline. There is less unpleasant overtone when I do the hammer on the 5th fret, and more so at the 12th. I CANNOT obtain a clean tone at the 12th fret with a hammer, especially if I try to shorten the duration. |
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Sarah
`Olu`olu
571 Posts |
Posted - 09/13/2005 : 03:52:36 AM
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Aloha mai e Slackkeygirl,
From one slack key girl to another *hee-hee* ...
I recall someone else asked about those hammers a while back, with regard that piece of Ozzie's, and my response was "play them fast and keep on playing." Ray Sowders already had similar advice for you -- I'm pleased to be in good company! :-)
That piece is one I stopped playing for a while because I could not make the hammers sound nice -- they were always jangly. When my hammers got a lot better, faster, lighter, I was more successful. The hammers are to blend in with the whole of the music, not stand out individually, in my opinion, and so in a sense, to "de-emphasize" them helps, but it's hard to do that when one is just learning.
So just hang in there, or maybe come back to the piece later on.
aloha,
Sarah |
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Peter Medeiros
`Olu`olu
546 Posts |
Posted - 09/13/2005 : 04:53:06 AM
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Actually,
You guys are working too hard and making it more difficult than it really should be. These are called triplets. There are three notes produced. The string is plucked once by the right hand, note one; the ring finger on the left hand bounces quickly in the middle of the fret (hammer and pulloff in one motion -- remember, don't think); two notes. The bounce should be done quickly in the middle of the fret -- it should give you a clean response.
Any extra sound means that you are either placing too close to the fret wire or adding an extra movement, such as trying to pick the string on the bounce. Practice this repeatedly for just a little while, it should sound like a mosquito buzzing in your ear.
Peter Medeiros |
Edited by - Peter Medeiros on 09/13/2005 05:31:15 AM |
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Slackkeygirl
Aloha
USA
5 Posts |
Posted - 09/13/2005 : 07:12:01 AM
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| Thank you Sarah for your wise analysis and suggestions for approach. Much appreciated. As for the idea that I am "working too hard," I am simply seeking suggestions and advice to get myself over what I perceive to be a rough patch with the techniques described. |
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Cthulhu
Aloha
USA
6 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2005 : 06:17:25 AM
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| Peter - thanks for the tip - I was having some issues with my hammers/pulls, but "bouncing" off the middle of the fret seems to have cleared that up nicely. Great to get a tip from one of Ozzie's teachers! |
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Pua Kai
Ha`aha`a
USA
1007 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2005 : 06:39:53 AM
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Aloha Diana!
The thing that helped me the most with hammers, chimes, slides, was to have the action "fixed" at my local guitar shop... It put my strings closer to the frets and has made a big difference.
Most important have fun... getting frustrated? change it so you can play it easily, then go back in a few months. You'll be amazed how much that can help.
And have you gone through Ray's on-line mini-lessons? They're terrific for rank beginners and those of us still struggling.
n |
Edited by - Pua Kai on 09/14/2005 06:41:20 AM |
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Slackkeygirl
Aloha
USA
5 Posts |
Posted - 09/15/2005 : 12:54:33 PM
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| Thanks everyone! Maybe some of my guitars are due for a fall/winter set up after all. In the meantime, I'll "play through" it. |
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rhnelson
Aloha
USA
9 Posts |
Posted - 09/24/2005 : 09:11:56 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Peter Medeiros
adding an extra movement, such as trying to pick the string on the bounce.
Aha!!! I've been doing that, trying to pluck the string with my left hand for the third note. Thanks. |
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slackkeymike
Lokahi
440 Posts |
Posted - 09/25/2005 : 07:23:34 AM
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Love that handle...SlackKeyGirl... for a moment, I thought you were Cindy Combs!!
I think hammers, pulls, plucks with the fret hand just come with time. As your fingers get stronger... it gets easier, and I do believe it has a lot to do with coordinated finger strength. Of course, a light action string helps to. Try some Elixir Nano Webs...awsome strings.
Oh, to all...I noticed on E-bay that great deals are to be had on Elixir strings (others as well) when buying in volume. I actually saw one where the per pack price was $6-8 if you bought 10 or 20???
Aloha,
Mike |
Aloha, Mike |
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sandman
Lokahi
USA
181 Posts |
Posted - 09/25/2005 : 10:38:17 AM
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Perhaps playing a classical makes it a bit more difficult, especially in terms of projection, although I know Ozzie plays one. Probably my ineptness factors into this equation. 
Sandy |
Leap into the boundless and make it your home.
Zhuang-zi |
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Sarah
`Olu`olu
571 Posts |
Posted - 09/29/2005 : 2:06:31 PM
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Aloha kakou,
I really like Peter's term "bounce" for the hammer action. It conveys the notion that you don't linger or hold the string too long.
E Slackkeygirl, another thought came to mind, as I was playing Ho'omalu Slack key, and doing hammers up at the 12th. I observed that I got much better hammers if my finger came down quite vertically to the fretboard. It is so easy, when reaching, to hammer at an angle. I surmise that the higher up the fretboard you go, the less forgiving it is of the angle of your "bounce". Straight "down" (perpendicular to the fretboard) seems to sound better.
aloha,
Sarah |
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Kapila Kane
Ha`aha`a
USA
1051 Posts |
Posted - 10/04/2005 : 05:05:04 AM
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Also, I've noticed that my cheaper guitar...won't mention names, makes this dissonance tone more pronounced than on the Goodall.
And the action and execution recommendations are "sound advice". |
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parlorplayer
Aloha
16 Posts |
Posted - 10/04/2005 : 05:07:34 AM
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| I think I was the one who posted the "old" frustration note about the 0 12 0 sounding bad. I've tried it on many guitars, some really expensive ones. The only one that it actually sounds pretty on, is my all mahogany Larrivee parlor. I felt better just knowing it could be done ---and enjoyed. I'm another woman hooked on Slack Key and apparently guitars... |
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