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mokupuni
Aloha
30 Posts |
 Posted - 09/14/2007 : 02:09:45 AM
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Aloha,
I would like to share a little of what I know and how I feel about the ferry.
Under the guise of being an added convenience for Hawaii's people, the super-ferry is a military focused operation with state government support to fast-track/exempt the EIS. "They" want to move the Stryker Brigade easily from Oahu to Hawaii island and further militarize our 'aina. Here are links that provide support for my statements.
Story about the mover/shaker behind the scenes. Former military.
http://pacific.bizjournals.com/pacific/stories/2005/03/21/daily33.html
Marketing video showing the ease of transporting military equipment (long load, but worth it)
http://www.austal.com/go/news-and-images/video?A=westpac1
Ship of fools by J.M. Buck / 07-26-2006
http://honoluluweekly.com/cover/2006/07/ship-of-fools/
Website demanding EIS
http://superferryimpact.com/#military
On the superferryimpact.com website are listed some potential social and environmental impacts. Here are some potential impacts we recently discussed in our office.
PESTS/INVADERS
- Coqui
- Mongoose
- Wiliwili wasp
- Fire Ants
- Ti leaf plant spotted disease
- Bio prospecting pollen
- Money hungry resource rapists driving their trucks to other islands, pillage, then return to sell
ie. Potentially desired items: 'opihi, limu, maile, rare native woods, rare shells, etc.
DO NOT sacrifice our 'aina, our kupuna, our resources, simply for convenience! 'A'ole loa!
Ku i ka pono, mai hana 'apiki.
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'O au iho no,
Liko Puha |
Edited by - mokupuni on 09/14/2007 02:31:03 AM |
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da_joka
Lokahi
361 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2007 : 05:11:10 AM
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I agree wit all da bad stuffs dat can happen wit da ferry ... case an point, da guys da wen ova to Maui wit dea trucks an wen grab couple truckloads of river stones fo da imu fo dake back to Oahu (i tink). But, bachi fo dem, da ferry no can take da trucks back ... ha ha ha.
How, since dey not making $$$ dea stay in Hawaii is almost pau ...
http://www.honoluluadvertiser.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070914/NEWS01/709140376
dass it. shootz. |
If can, can. If no can, no can. |
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mahimahi
Aloha
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2007 : 05:39:16 AM
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| On a whim my friend and I took the Superferry on Aug 27 for $10 per person round trip...this was perhaps a maiden voyage or trial run to get the kinks out....in my opinion it was no thrill for me unless I wanted to unwind and read on the boat....It may be useful for someone who is moving from another island to another and needed to bring their car(s) with them...I don't know the exact pros & cons politics behind all this but it comes down to business & money versus too much commercialization and destruction of nature.....I say get rid of the cars, highrises and businesses whose greed is for over development and bring back the hula girls, hand made surf boards & luaus.....James |
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wcerto
Ahonui
USA
5052 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2007 : 07:02:30 AM
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jwn - I agree wholeheartedly with you about being proactive. Once the damage is done it is way too late. This is the conundrum, though. Many kama`aina are in favor of a more cost effective way for inter-island travel, Cost effective has to also include the cost of damage/potential damage to the `aina. Costs can be direct costs in financial terms or can be costs of the damage to the land, the water, the infrastructure, the economy, etc. Even cultural costs such as bones rmoved from where they should lay.
Please forgive me for being naive, but if the people don't want it or if the people want an EIS prior to operation of the Ferry, then don't they have the power to get that what they deem necessary? The Ferry is a business and as such, they have customers or potential customers. No one will force anyone to ride the Ferry. Just say no.
Regarding Liko's comments about military using the ferry to move Stryker units -- probably sounds like a swell idea to DoD. They now have a way to move stuff very easily from island to island without it being a cost attributable and allocable to DoD. However, absent the Ferry, they still have plenty ways of moving equipment. C-5As and C-17s are some mammer-jammer cargo aircraft. Helcopters (the infamous "sky crane" can move materiel. Many other ways. But like I said, since this Ferry was developed by private enterprise, Dod can reap the benefits of it without having to pay for it. That is a bigger Goliath to slay than just the consortium who runs the Ferry business. That is a powerful player in the game and may trump everything else.
One other point, Liko. The video about the Dept. of Navy (Marines) using one of these ferries is not the one being used in Hawai`i for passenger transport. It looks as though the one the Navy is speaking about in the video was purchased in 2001 and has been in use for a while. It is what we in DoD call GO/CO - government owned, contractor operated.
Do any of you have opinions to share on how the Ferry could be handled in a pono way? A way to protect all the things we have seen have the potential to affect the entire atmosphere of the outer islands?
If your job was to make a way to transport folks economically and effectively from island to island without hurting the environment, how would you accomplish it? Can it possibly be done at all? |
Me ke aloha
Malama pono,
Wanda |
Edited by - wcerto on 09/14/2007 07:33:15 AM |
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da_joka
Lokahi
361 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2007 : 07:29:28 AM
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Wass wrong wit keeping travel between da islands by air only? (except da Maui county ferry). I tink in all da years of commercial travel in HI, only had one majah accident, da Aloha dat wen get da roof ripped off ova Maui. Odda den dat, I tink statistically, it's been real "safe" an good way fo go between islands. Da only downside was 9/11 wen all da planes had fo stay ontop da ground.
But, is it really a bad ting fo be "stuck" on one odda island in Hawai`i? :-) |
If can, can. If no can, no can. |
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PuaLynn
Lokahi
USA
120 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2007 : 08:34:34 AM
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| Cars moving between the islands will continue the spread of the alien species that are causing havoc to bird and plant life and to the human ear. Case in point .. the horrendous coqui frog that has taken over parts of the Big Island. This tiny frog from Puerto Rico makes an enormous high pitched sound. If you find yourself in Hilo, head for one of the streams after the sun goes down and listen. Then maybe you'll think twice about encouraging cars (and all they carry) to travel between islands. Hawaii is fragile and is rapidly being destroyed by business greed, the military and residents who don't think about long term implications. But, that's only in my humble opinion. |
Me ke aloha,
Lynn |
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noeau
Ha`aha`a
USA
1105 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2007 : 09:31:49 AM
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In many ways we are all on the same page about this. But your post with with the Exxon had good points but you origin ally were not very clear about it. The exxon definitely had done a lot of damage. However they were in legal rights to sail where they sailing even if I feel that the pristine condition of the area should not have been compromised in the first place. All these super tankers have made EIS and so what came of that? A drunken captain ran the boat aground. Where exactly is my post simplistic? I attacked and pointed out that big money usually gets its way and this forum is not going to stop what is happening with the ferry in Hawai'i. Its OK that you disagree and your second post makes more sense and is clearer but also bear in mind a lot of those tragedies occurred in places where safety is not of primary concern. Any human undertaking presents some risk and you are right to say that precautions should be taken to mitigate any events that will cost lives, property and damage the environment. I don't know if an EIS provides for that. Other plans and policies are usually developed to address those those things that you have pointed out. I'm pretty sure that the super ferry has considered these things.
This is a very emotional issue and a lot of people are throwing anything they can at it. There is no proof just supposition that all the bad things mentioned will come to fruition. Again I must say that I am not just supporting the super ferry , I want to see some sort of alternate means of transportation between the island that is feasible for most of the residents living there. I don't want to support the military if they use it and I am not promoting tourism. And how does anyone know that Honolulu people going take the natural resources from the islands any way. With air transport today people from all islands already go where they want to fish and pound opihi and gather plants and hunt and see granma and granpa. So why this big resistance to some progress that may or may not bring good or bad things to Hawaii? Like anything else ,if the economics don't work the business will not succeed so maybe we just wait and see. Don't take this wrong and I don't mean to offend anyone but we don't know what we are talking about myself included. |
No'eau, eia au he mea pa'ani wale nō. |
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hapakid
Luna Ho`omalu
USA
1533 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2007 : 09:42:00 AM
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Noeau,
There is a general negative feeling here about the ferry, especially before it's done any damage. That's too bad. Of all the bad things that have happened to the po'e/'aina/kai, this seems a minor threat.
I would like to see the ferry run for awhile to see whether all the fear-mongering is valid.
Those damn screeching frogs on Maui have made the Kapalua Ritz-Carlton almost uninhabitable. I can't afford to stay there, so I can't complain too much!
I found JWN's list of ferry accidents, as a reason to stop the Superferry, to be odd. I don't see that as a reason not to put a ship in the water. You could also list airplane accidents as a reason not to go Hawai'i by plane. I try not to think about other plane crashes when I get on that five-hour plane ride:) In fact I find the safety record of mainland-Hawaii flights to be nothing short of amazing.
Jesse |
Edited by - hapakid on 09/14/2007 09:46:48 AM |
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Ginny
Aloha
43 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2007 : 10:52:57 AM
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Hapa It was my understanding that the environmental assessment or lack of one was just the last attempt of environmentalists to stall the super ferry. Not super current on this myself but it seems to me that the greater concern for all should be how if successful this vessel will speed up development of the outer islands. You hear oh the SF will increase traffic but the larger concern I should think would be home development.
wcerto If you could find a "pono" way of replacing Hanalei bridge than perhaps you could find a "pono" way of operating this ferry. The two are very analogous in my mind, people keep that small bridge to retain Hanalei's charm and small size. Not sure why the same protection would not go up against this ferry.
I don't think the small number of protestors was missed by any decision makers either. What was there a few dozen in the water? ...some JUVENILES. Think we should have seen a few thousand for legislators to care, unfortunately. Just my two cents. |
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Ginny
Aloha
43 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2007 : 11:18:16 AM
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| Mokupuni, thanks for those links |
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Julie H
Ha`aha`a
USA
1206 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2007 : 7:08:32 PM
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I'm thinking that a big part of the problem is the sheer size of the vessel. Were it smaller, less intrusive, more easily controlled via car inspections, etc, not so imposing on the aina and the kai, AND had the company jumped through all the hoops regarding EIR's and such, then it might have been more readily accepted.
NOBODY likes someone cutting into the front of the line without paying their dues...
Julie |
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wcerto
Ahonui
USA
5052 Posts |
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Julie H
Ha`aha`a
USA
1206 Posts |
Posted - 09/17/2007 : 5:29:46 PM
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Scientists say whale killed by ship
The Associated Press
Article Launched: 09/16/2007 12:45:18 PM PDT
VENTURA, Calif.—Marine wildlife scientists testing the carcass of a blue whale that washed ashore believed the 140,000-pound creature was killed in a collision with a ship.
A necropsy revealed a 15-foot bruise on the mammal's back side consistent with a "ship strike," Santa Barbara Museum of Natural History spokeswoman Easter Moorman said.
Scientists taking blubber, skin, blood and other samples found extensive damage to the whale's bones. Museum officials had wanted to preserve the whale's skeleton for display, but found many bones to be damaged and now plan to save only the skull, Moorman said.
The 72-foot-long blue whale, listed as a federally endangered species, washed onto a beach near a campground Thursday. Teams on Saturday hauled the animal about two miles down the Santa Barbara Channel to a beach where scientists conducted tests.
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wcerto
Ahonui
USA
5052 Posts |
Posted - 09/17/2007 : 6:17:18 PM
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SUPPOSEDLY the catamaran design of the super ferry is what will help it avoid collisions with marine life. How true that is, I do not know, but it sounds logical, looking at the design and "footprint" of the twin hulls. Nonetheless, the hulls are still big. Supposedly they have routes to avoid during peak whale season and have to have spotters on duty at all times looking for whales. Evasive maneuvers must be taken whenever they are within a certain range of whales. They have to keep a log of whale sightings.
On PAPER their plan appears to be pretty comprehensive and appears to the untrained eye that it will be about as effective as possible. However, animals don't know they are supposed to keep away from the ferry.
When we took our first cruise in Hawaiian waters, we saw plenty whales on the way to Maui. What a sight to behold. This was a big boat, believe you me. How they can go through the water without killing the whales? They have those been twin disels with big propellers. The ferry has no propellers. At least they won't be cutting them up.
Pros and cons for every side. We drive our cars every day even though sometimes someone strikes a person or dog or cat or runs over a bunny with the car. Folks ride motorcycles all the time even though that is an accident just waiting to happen. Planes fall out of the sky. Trains derail.
How do we juggle need with malama `aina? |
Me ke aloha
Malama pono,
Wanda |
Edited by - wcerto on 09/17/2007 6:19:17 PM |
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PuaLynn
Lokahi
USA
120 Posts |
Posted - 09/17/2007 : 8:04:02 PM
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| I'm sorry .. this thread is driving me buggy. The ferry is not good for the islands. Period. A smaller boat to move people, perhaps. Not this monster ship. There is no need to move cars between the islands .. and the prices are such that local people will not be able to afford this as the way to visit auntie or uncle on the next island with their car. And, the last place you should be getting your info is from the ferry's website. Check out the local papers and their blogs / comment area. Let's not apply mainland reasoning to these fragile islands. |
Me ke aloha,
Lynn |
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