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Absolute
Lokahi
275 Posts |
 Posted - 09/07/2007 : 11:54:49 AM
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I just installed the wound, low G string from a set of Aquila concert strings on my other birdhouse ukulele. I played through Hi'ilawe and Sanoe from "Discovering the Ukulele". My eyes are still misting.
I can't believe that the low G string set discussion from some months ago was so non-commital and dry. The Aquila low G string set creates a tone from heaven (or whatever metaphysical paradise you happen to regard as being culturally significant to you) when used for fingerstyle playing. I said before that I believed the low G string set would be the future of the ukulele based merely on the technical advantages. Hearing is believing (at least for fingerstyle performance. I'll keep my other birdhouse ukulele strung with the regular strings for chord based playing - no angry bees in the background that way if I decide to strum rapidly.)
Myth busting:
The wound string's tone is not consistent with the other Nylgut strings - Not true for fingerstyle performance. I thought I had run into that, at least until I finally got all the strings tuned properly, not just approximately. (Note: If you strum away as usual on a chord based melody you do run the risk of creating something that sounds like an angry bee in the background if you strum quickly rather than in a measured fashion. I cut it down by focusing my strumming over the bottom three strings, which means I strike the low G string with less force and by strumming less quickly. It could bother some people if they strum quickly given the long resonant period of the low G string.)
The wound string eliminates the traditional tone of the ukulele - Not in my opinion for fingerstyle playing with only occassional strums. It adds a depth and a long resonance that is absent, thus enhancing it.
I'm looking forward to using this long resonant string to form the bass note in a simple slack key ukulele work.
I'm still a bit overwhelmed by the sound emotionally, so take this with a grain of salt, but if you miss the low G string set from Aquila and you play fingerstyle pieces, you're living in the past.
The low G string went on like a charm. Difficulty of installation was no different from the original, unwound "G" string. It fit in the nut slot just fine. (Of course,I'd made the nut slot, and it might have been a little wider than it needed to be. My "saddle" doesn't have a slotted bridge on top, just a block of wood in front of the saddle with holes drilled in it, and the 1/8" drill bit hole fit the new string with room to spare. In other words, my set-up is very versatile. If you have a slotted bridge, finding out it won't fit might cost you $8.00 from "Musicguymic" on E-bay, who got this set to me via regular mail, in a birthday card envelope, for $0.88. You'll still have three replacement strings of the usual variety.
I hope you have a chance to enjoy the tone that the low G string set from Aquila bestows. It is truly a gift. (I strummed "Aloha Oe", and it sounds deeper, but it's still "Aloha Oe".)
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Thank you. |
Edited by - Absolute on 09/07/2007 12:44:10 PM |
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Momi
Lokahi
402 Posts |
Posted - 09/07/2007 : 12:16:55 PM
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I've played with a low G for almost 30 years. I think it gives me more range and a different tone, especially when playing finger style.
I have heard equally impassioned people who advocate for the regular G because they don't want to be playing something that sounds like a smaller guitar. Or they just like the higher sound. I think James Hill typically plays with the higher G. |
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wcerto
Ahonui
USA
5052 Posts |
Posted - 09/07/2007 : 12:26:57 PM
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| Momi - you opened your self up for Retro to say something rude about a "G" string. |
Me ke aloha
Malama pono,
Wanda |
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Momi
Lokahi
402 Posts |
Posted - 09/07/2007 : 12:47:59 PM
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Ah, but notice I didn't say "G string" - I just said low G (open to double-entendres in itself, but not quite so easy).
Sorry Absolute - back to our regularly scheduled thread. |
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hikabe
Lokahi
USA
358 Posts |
Posted - 09/07/2007 : 1:06:22 PM
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High g is old school. More and more people will be using low g in years to come. Also, the alto and tenor will be retuned, similer to the violin family. Yes, that means transposing the music to different keys for all 4 ukes. This will give the uke family full spectrum of the range it encompasses, from baritone to soprano. I'm talking about 50 years from now, when people become less giddy about the uke and treat it like any other instrument.
James Hill, I believe, plays low g. It's people like John King who are still holding out in the re-entrant tuning craze. John is the expert of high g string style of playing.
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Stay Tuned... |
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Absolute
Lokahi
275 Posts |
Posted - 09/07/2007 : 1:18:08 PM
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I completely agree that the ukulele is still in the phase in which it is gaining widespread acceptance. And as you suggest, that means ongoing developments in the instrument family and its evolution.
I've played through several of the pieces in "Discovering the Ukulele" on both the Low G ukulele and the one with the regular string set. (It's a great book of music, by the way. Both the fingerstyle pieces and the chord versions are enjoyable.) I'm just glad I built two birdhouse ukuleles, so I can have both tunings. The regular tuning is sweet, but a bit light with regard to tonal depth. Of course, its still a nice platform for music making. The Low G set lends such depth and range, as well as an opportunity to take advantage of its sustain! (Note: the two ukuleles are virtually identical.) I am left to wonder if one can install nothing but Aquila metal wound strings to add sustain and more "balance" if one is strumming quickly. |
Thank you. |
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Retro
Ahonui
USA
2368 Posts |
Posted - 09/07/2007 : 1:18:39 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Momi
Ah, but notice I didn't say "G string" - I just said low G
And as someone with three "g"s in his name, I can get to be a pretty low character.
I've used both; my preference is a low G as well. |
Edited by - Retro on 09/07/2007 1:19:16 PM |
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Momi
Lokahi
402 Posts |
Posted - 09/07/2007 : 8:05:59 PM
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From James Hill's website (ukulelejames.com):
"What tuning(s) do you use?
Like all students of the Doane ukulele method, I grew up playing in D6 tuning (a, d, f#, b) with a low A string. It wasn't until my late-teens that I started to fool around with other tunings. Nowadays I travel with two ukes: one with a high 4th string and another with a low 4th string."
I don't see anything wrong with old school high G. Some folks in the Seattle `Ukulele Players' Association like the high G it because they're after the Tin Pan Alley sound - it's just not the sound I'm looking for. |
Edited by - Momi on 09/07/2007 8:08:27 PM |
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noeau
Ha`aha`a
USA
1105 Posts |
Posted - 09/07/2007 : 8:58:45 PM
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| When I got my first uke in1961 I learned that some people used the low G. There were no sets yet for that arrangement so I just swapped the G and the C around and tuned accordingly.. I never no any better and i just played like that. Also I kept the strings on for a year or more and only changed when they were so stretched out that they broke if I tuned to concert pitch. Most of the time we just tuned to the guitar cause it had the most strings. It was always "give me a G?" Ah, those were the days my friend. The chords were called funny names like second G and second F besides just plain F and G or D7, A7 etc. etc. Oh the uke? It was a martin tenor all mahogany uke for the price of $79.00. I thought that was expensive since a Strat cost $175.00 or something like that. |
No'eau, eia au he mea pa'ani wale nō. |
Edited by - noeau on 09/07/2007 8:59:57 PM |
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Absolute
Lokahi
275 Posts |
Posted - 09/08/2007 : 1:48:04 PM
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| I think most people who know nothing about ukuleles get what is sent with most instruments, a string set meant for standard tuning. If they buy the instrument to merely strum along to songs, they're happy they did (no long resonant wound low G string ringing constantly in the background). If they want to play primarily fingerstyle instead of strumming, the low G makes good sense. Too bad there isn't a Nylgut string set with more wound strings for G-C-E-A tuning, so the G string isn't resonating alone. (I suppose most people go the opposite direction, and avoid wound strings.) Makes me wonder what Aquila's new "perfect fifths" set, with 3rd and 4th wound strings, might do and whether the 3rd string from it could be tuned to C. If it starts on G, five whole tones up would be above E, which means middle C should be a lower tension load. (I guess at what "perfect fifth" means.) I can't seem to find that set or the two string 3rd and 4th wound set from the Nylgut perfect fifths set anywhere. I suppose I could order a tenor wound G string, which should be capable of more tension, and install it on a slightly smaller scale (16") birdhouse ukulele as the 3rd string, and hope that tuning it up to C doesn't do bad things to the instrument or my fingers due to the tension, but the diameter might cause some buzzing in the nut slot. I'd like to stick with Aquila's Nylgut on all strings. (The D-VI and similar products are making more sense for ukulele players who want to try slack key music. Install wound G and C strings in the 5 & 6 slots for long resonant tones, then a plain set of Aquila Nylgut G-C-E-A in the first four. You then have a two string bass, with a four string ukulele, for fingerstyle performance. Forget strumming chords in the usual style. Keep your old ukulele for that.) |
Thank you. |
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hwnmusiclives
`Olu`olu
USA
580 Posts |
Posted - 09/08/2007 : 3:37:37 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Absolute
I think most people who know nothing about ukuleles get what is sent with most instruments, a string set meant for standard tuning. If they buy the instrument to merely strum along to songs, they're happy they did (no long resonant wound low G string ringing constantly in the background). If they want to play primarily fingerstyle instead of strumming, the low G makes good sense.
I actually prefer the low-G for strumming - especially if you play a very jazz-oriented chord style. Jazz chords sound too tight with the "G" and the "A" so close together. For the same reason, when I play jazz chord melody- fingerstyle - the low-G sounds nicer to me, too.
I have two identical Kamaka tenors (made about 15 years apart) and I keep one strung with the high-G and one strung with the low-G. I find that the high-G makes more sense for solo single string work and to recreate the tremolo - or mandolin - effect which I attain by using my thumb on the G-string and middle finger on the A-string and rapidly trilling them in thirds, fifths, or even in unison. (I find it easier to tremolo the same unison note on the two strings than try to pluck the same string twice as fast.)
I wish Herb, Jr. would chime in here. I learned by listening to his father's albums, and I am certain that Herb, Sr. switched back and forth from low-G to high-G. I could not have recreated some of his licks if I had used only a low-G tuned uke.
Oh, and I still want to try out an Aquila low-G set. But I solved the problem you describe, Absolute - of the wound G-string resonating alone - by using two Kamaka tenor sets together and using the wound string from both as the C-string and the G-string.
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Join me for the history of Hawaiian music and its musicians at Ho`olohe Hou at www.hoolohehou.org. |
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Absolute
Lokahi
275 Posts |
Posted - 09/09/2007 : 08:20:17 AM
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Aquila makes a "perfect 5th's" set for the concert ukulele. I use concert strings on mine, though its got a 16 inch fingerboard. (I built it. Knew nothing about standard lengths, and decided I wanted something longer than a concert, but I wasn't sure how much longer would "work" and still produce a sound like a ukulele with the available strings. I was afraid I wouldn't be able to get long enough strings if I went beyond sixteen inches, and would then have to buy guitar strings, which I didn't want.) Back to the Aquilas. I learned two things.
1. You can buy JUST a low G wound string under the Aquila brand for around $2.00 for any G-C-E-A string set, and save the price of the rest of the strings (around $5.00 difference!)
2. Aquila sells two wound strings from its "perfect 5th's" set as another specialty item. If that means you can tune both strings to or just UNDER their intended tension, I think that would be a better solution, particularly given the less than $3.00 price of the pair of strings in the set. I just don't know the intended tuning of those two wound strings. If its "low G" and "E" then dropping the "E" down to "C" solves the saddle tension loading/hard on the fingers problem. (Unfortunately, no one seems to sell either the "perfect 5th's set for the ukulele, or the two wound strings set from the "perfect 5ths" set.)
I hate to install a "low G" concert length string and tune it three FULL tones higher. I'm afraid of the tension load, both on my saddle, and on my fingers! I also hesitate due to the noise made when you run your finger down a wound string. The tenor set uses a wound "C" string, not a wound "G" string. Maybe I should give it a try.
(Note: I just pushed the "low G" string up to middle C, and didn't care for the tension load due to pressure required to fret. Also was concerned about long term impact on saddle. Wound strings are not good if you use slides in your works. Fortunately most people don't do much with the G string in terms of finding notes. The C string is also less used than say, the A string.)
I wrote my first "slack key style" piece for "low G" - C- E- A tuning last night. This tuning is a great platform for that kind of music. I was instructed, in a book, to avoid using the G string for notes. It was good advice. It leaves it free as my "bass note", and a long resonant low G string makes a great bass note. I just wish I could lend some of its rich tone to the other strings.
Because tenor set you have uses a wound "C" string instead of a wound "G" string, you're all set. You just slacken the "C" to produce low G. (I'd suggest you just order the Aquila tenor set and the extra tenor "low G" string if you go with an Aquila set.) I think I'll order an Aquila tenor set and extract the wound "C" string, or maybe e-mail the manufacturer and let them know they need to start producing a concert or a tenor set with wound low G and middle C strings! (I hope this will work with my 16" inch string length!) |
Thank you. |
Edited by - Absolute on 09/09/2007 08:55:25 AM |
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Mark
Ha`aha`a
USA
1628 Posts |
Posted - 09/09/2007 : 12:26:00 PM
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I'm old school. B'sides, I like to use the term "reentrant tuning," makes me feel smart.
That being said, I like both the hi and lo G sounds. However, like Ab, I didn't care for the differnece between the wound low G and the rest of the Aquillas. (Also, the wound G tends to de-wind pretty quikly.)
I'd suggest getting a set with all four wound strings. Far better for balance and tone. Guadalupe Custom Strings makes a set like that for $12.
Happy ukein' |
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da_joka
Lokahi
361 Posts |
Posted - 09/09/2007 : 1:23:52 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Momi
I think James Hill typically plays with the higher G.
Doesn't Jake usually play hi? Like some of you I also didn't like the would low G because of the squeaks. Since I've been playing my tenor mostly, I'm torn between getting an unwound low G string or keeping mine wit da high G ... no mo kala fo get one odda uke ... decisions decisions. |
If can, can. If no can, no can. |
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Absolute
Lokahi
275 Posts |
Posted - 09/09/2007 : 2:19:50 PM
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I remembered the previous post about the wound strings. I'm just afraid to use anything other than Aquilas. I ordered a set of Aquila tenors with the low wound C option to get the low wound C string from it. That makes the total cost for a low wound G and low wound C $14.00 from MusicGuyMic for two sets of strings (one concert low G set and one tenor with wound C string set). I hesitate to use wound E and A strings, because I don't want the high friction and squeaking if I do a slide on the A string, where that seems most likely the way I play. I may order a set just to try them and see how bad the "squeaks" are on the E and A strings. They use nylon on their wound strings, which may have a lower coefficient of friction than the metal used on the wound G and C strings. I ordered the wound C tenor set to try to get more of the rich tone the low wound G gives me on the C string, and gain some balance that way. (The wound low G string also gives me VERY long lasting natural harmonics on the 12th fret that are easier to generate.)
UPDATE: I just got word back from Aquila. They do make and sell a two string set of wound low G and C strings for concert sized ukuleles (tenors too). It costs $1.91. Musicguymic doesn't sell them. I was told by Aquila they would sell them to me directly. I am looking into the shipping cost. Also, it turned out that I needed to replace my strings. They'd gone a bit flat, which probably affected my sense of balance with regard to the tone somewhat. (Not surprising; these were the original strings I used when I had more than a quarter inch of action at the nut, before I fixed that problem. They were pretty stretched out from all the adjustments I made.
SECOND UPDATE: I just tuned my low G - C- E-A in between concert and tenor length ukulele to D-G-B-E, and guess what? It sounds much better! The tone and tonal durations are much more balanced. I didn't have to go with the wound C string, just slack all the strings down three full tones.
THIRD UPDATE: I think this "birdhouse" ukulele, due to its heavy, plywood construction, has a natural resonance around "low G". The third string, normally tuned to "C", now tuned to "low G", is creating the same dominant tone that the wound low G" string was creating before. I am tempted to move the tuning up a full tone on all strings, but I like the way this "low G" tuning brings this heavy built ukulele to life for fingerstyle playing. (I may order the wound "low G" and middle C set from Aquila, and see what it does on my storebought Baja ukulele.)
Note: I was just told by Mr. Mimmo Peruffo of Aquila in Italy that shipping of the low G and middle C strings would be two Euros, or around $2.40, depending on the exchange rate, about which I am guessing conservatively. |
Thank you. |
Edited by - Absolute on 09/10/2007 08:53:04 AM |
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Momi
Lokahi
402 Posts |
Posted - 09/09/2007 : 5:29:55 PM
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quote:
Doesn't Jake usually play hi?
I think Jake plays with a low G. I will pay special attention when we see his concert on 10/13. That is, if I can keep track of those hummingbird-wing-fast fingers. |
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