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Larry Goldstein
Lokahi
267 Posts |
 Posted - 12/28/2007 : 1:02:34 PM
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Not really a new story, but here are some recent data.
Hawaii residents flee expensive islands
The Associated Press
HONOLULU — Nearly 10,000 Hawaii residents moved from the islands to the mainland in the year ending July 1, the largest exodus in at least eight years, according to the U.S. Census Bureau.
Steep housing prices, inflation and the growing gap between the cost of living in Hawaii and on the mainland are driving residents away, economists said.
The overall state population grew by 4,753 U.S. residents, or 0.4 percent, to a total of 1,283,388 since July 2006. There were 19,265 births and 9,269 deaths, as well as 4,112 new residents from other countries. But 9,673 people moved away.
The population trend could make it harder for local employers to find workers, said Eugene Tian, research and statistics officer for the state Department of Business, Economic Development and Tourism.
"We need people, and people are moving out due to the cost of living and housing prices," Tian said. "Everywhere else on the mainland there has been a decline in housing prices, but we don't see that in Hawaii."
Hawaii's unemployment rate was 2.9 percent in November compared to 4.7 percent nationally, according to government figures.
Inflation is pushing the state's housing, food, gasoline and energy costs further from the national average, making the mainland more attractive to Hawaii residents, said Paul Brewbaker, chief economist for the Bank of Hawaii.
"When we entered the 2000s, Hawaii wasn't that much more expensive than the mainland on average, and it was even cheaper than other places such as Orange County and San Francisco," Brewbaker said. "That's changed. The gap is widening."
The Census Bureau data show Hawaii trailing all other Western states in population growth, behind even Alaska, Idaho and Montana.
Larry
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javeiro
Lokahi
USA
459 Posts |
Posted - 12/28/2007 : 3:04:06 PM
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| Thanks for posting that, Larry. While I suspected as much, this is the first time I've seen actual data. I guess I'm an example of that trend, although we really moved to be closer to our kids and grandkids. Our children decided to move away because they felt that they wouldn't be able to afford to buy a home in Hawaii. Plus the cost of living there has always been higher than on the mainland and they knew that the gap would likely be getting larger. I personally know of many others with similar stories. |
Aloha,
John A. |
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wcerto
Ahonui
USA
5052 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2007 : 06:44:10 AM
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So many Hawaiian ex-pats are settling on the West Coast (especially Calfornia). Housing prices there are so beyond anything I can gathom that I am amazed that living there is cheaper than living in Hawai`i. If you wan't to leave cheap, come here to Ohio where you can have a beautiful house for well under $200,000. Matter of fact, for that kind of money, you would have a mansion almost. Plenty of jobs to be had, too, in health care, computers and manufacturing. We have a NASA research center that will soon be hiring up. Then we can start the Cuke Club - the Cleveland Ukulele Players or something like that.
When I look at the federal jobs web site for Hawai`i, I am amazed at the numbers of jobs available from GS-3 clerks up to Senior Executive Service political appointees. Plus you get a 25% salary bonus for living/working in Hawai`i due to cost of living.
Pros and cons no matter where you go. |
Me ke aloha
Malama pono,
Wanda |
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Ianui
Lokahi
USA
298 Posts |
Posted - 12/31/2007 : 06:25:28 AM
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| Many are coming to Las Vegas. Our Hawaiian population now exceeds 90,000 and is growing rapidly. Jobs are plentful, and nice affordable housing is available. |
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Bd1
Lokahi
USA
114 Posts |
Posted - 12/31/2007 : 3:36:11 PM
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| There are over 5000 Hawaiians living in Florida! |
BD1 |
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justinalderfer
Aloha
USA
27 Posts |
Posted - 01/02/2008 : 09:40:58 AM
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| God knows we could use more Aloha in Florida! |
ka loku mele kaona |
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noeau
Ha`aha`a
USA
1105 Posts |
Posted - 01/02/2008 : 11:23:43 AM
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I must have moved to the wrong place. Things here are not any cheaper than Hawaii as far as I can see. The sales tax in WA is horrendous even with out a personal income tax. The property tax? Fugeddaboutit. How come the Gasoline prices keep going up? One thing though Hawaii is too small and the people running things there are idiots so the services and other things that are available up here outstrip Hawaii's capability of providing quality services to its own people. There are many more reasons to leave the state than just housing prices. The prices never drop?? I wonder, we sold our Hawaii home for less than what we paid. So take economists statements with a grain of salt.
Having said that it is still the best place in the world for most things. |
No'eau, eia au he mea pa'ani wale nō. |
Edited by - noeau on 01/02/2008 11:25:00 AM |
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justplainbill
Akahai
USA
53 Posts |
Posted - 01/02/2008 : 1:56:46 PM
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| I was told by a few people that there are more Hawaiians in Las Vegas than there are in Hawaii. Don't konow if that's true of course, but it shows sure shows a trend. The rising price of housing has some families living in vans etc from what I have read in the Honolulu papers. It's all about money, and the Hawaiians are always on the short end of the stick. I wouldn't be surprised to see half a dozen new hi-rise hotels built in the middle of Kapiolani park!! |
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Ianui
Lokahi
USA
298 Posts |
Posted - 01/02/2008 : 5:36:30 PM
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Las Vegas has the largest Hawaiian population outside of Hawaii than anywhere else in the US.
There is no real industry in Hawaii and most people are schooled in service jobs like hotel and tourest needs.
Las Vegas has these types of jobs. So people come. Mom and dad and cousin all follow.
We have over 50 million visitors a year and its still growing. We get 10,000 visitors from Hawaii a week. Boyd Gaming who ownes 5 big casino's has travel agency that specializes in bringing them here.
Two plane loads are arriving from Hawaii just for my partner "Uncle Paul" Super Bowl party.
You can get a pretty nice new condo in the $150,000 to $250,000 range. Some houses as well.
AND we are still growing In the next three year an additional 41,000 new hotel rooms will be added.Hotels operate at a 90+% occupancy rate Fri to Sun and may drop to 60% during the week in the slow season.
No state income tax. We do have 8.75%sales tax. Gas is currently 3.29 for 92 octane. Very business friendly government agencies.I also find places like DMV are very efficient. It took less than a 1 hour visit to register two cars, swap Calif drivers lic for Nevada lic, and register to vote. My wife and I walked out with license plates for each car, and perminate drivers lic with pictures.
Three months of the year its HOT but you are usually in an air conditioned car, building or home. My utility bills go to about $300.00 in those months. Thats water, electric and trash pick up which is twice a week.
Soooo while its not for everyone, its not a bad place to be. |
Edited by - Ianui on 01/02/2008 5:45:41 PM |
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chunky monkey
Ha`aha`a
USA
1022 Posts |
Posted - 01/03/2008 : 07:53:34 AM
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| Don is being kind to Vegas re the heat. It's 6 months and hot means 300 degrees or something like that |
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cpatch
Ahonui
USA
2187 Posts |
Posted - 01/03/2008 : 09:14:35 AM
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| Yes, but it's DRY heat (so is an oven, of course). |
Craig
My goal is to be able to play as well as people think I can. |
Edited by - cpatch on 01/03/2008 09:15:00 AM |
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javeiro
Lokahi
USA
459 Posts |
Posted - 01/03/2008 : 6:10:24 PM
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noeau:
If you think that living in Washington is not any cheaper than living in Hawaii then you must not do the grocery shopping or shop for clothing or other goods. As for taxes, according to the Retirement Living Information Center which tracks total tax burden by state, Hawaii ranks No. 6 (No. 1 being the highest total taxes) and Washington is No. 16. There is some other interesting information at the same web site too if you're curious.
http://www.retirementliving.com/RLtaxburdens.html |
Aloha,
John A. |
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Kapila Kane
Ha`aha`a
USA
1051 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2008 : 10:53:37 PM
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"Hawaii's unemployment rate was 2.9 percent in November compared to 4.7 percent nationally, according to government figures."
AND WHAT, pray tell, DO THESE JOBS PAY?
In Hawaii, like many expensive places, (i.e. California, Colorado), these are often tough and/or low-paying jobs that not everyone thrives on, or they will need 2 or more of to stay at their current poverty level...
Less Native Hawaiians means less of the authentic culture and personality that makes a place desirable...and more high end real-estate, more gated communities where all once freely walked, and more economic slavery, while many poorer workers have to drive farther to come to the work that some people require to maintain their absurd consumption...and unlike most things in Hawaii, labor often is at bargain prices.
And most still cant' play a turnaround or sing, or even know that "Blue Hawaii" ain't the pinnacle of Hawaiian music culture...and it aint' just cute/quaint stuff to amuse tourists, it's breathing, living art, heartful, beautiful, soulful love of family, the earth and our essential connections to each other.
Is that vog or steam coming out of my ears? |
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noeau
Ha`aha`a
USA
1105 Posts |
Posted - 01/05/2008 : 8:03:09 PM
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well I must live on the expensive side. Property tax is 10k and groceries average for me about 130.00 per visit about 2-3 x per week. Shoes over 100.00 per pair. underwear about 20.00 per pair. I'm not a Wal-mart kind of guy. I understand what you mean. If i scrimp and look for sales i might not spend as much but that is me. I go to Kona Kitchen to jam, breakfast for 2= 22.00 music played while there priceless. I'm not complaining Just making an observation between the two places. Lucky I don't drink or I'd be broke already. Concert tickets still cost 65.00 for stars like Neil Young so its the same ting.
To me I'd rather see sovereignty and be poor. But the rich people who are from elsewhere who think they can exploit the islands as their own personal playground just because they can own the land welcome price increases because then the "riff-raff" going leave. Then you'll have PhD cabdrivers and yard men serving the people who have no inkling of what Hawai'i is and was and could be again. Most of the people who leave sadly enough have good reasons for leaving and the cost of living is the most prevalent. Thats why I say the local and state gov't are full of idiots beacause they can't see their way to serve the people. Tey only see short term goals that fill their pockets. That is however a national trend.
So how about them Cubs? |
No'eau, eia au he mea pa'ani wale nō. |
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wcerto
Ahonui
USA
5052 Posts |
Posted - 01/06/2008 : 12:49:51 AM
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Same thing down in W. Va. Poor folks moved to Cleveland-Akron-Dayton-Detroit to find jobs. Now W. Va. has rich folks who bought cheap land and built swell houses while the poor folks live in trailer houses. Just like Hawai`i, the economy is now based on tourism. Nothing much down there but mountains and rivers and beautiful things in nature, plus the "culture" -- banjo music, fiddle music and arts and crafts. It is ever so "quaint" for the flatlanders to go to W. Va., spend some kala on handmade soap or rustic pottery, buy a CD of fiddle tunes and then go home to their city condo when they are finished the weekend.
There are 16 pages or more of federal jobs open in Hawai`i (see www.usajobs.gov ) , all pretty good paying jobs. Certainly paying better than hotel or restaurant jobs. Why folks no want to fill federal jobs? Good pay, good bennies. Can retire at a decent age.
What bothers me most about tourism and different cultures, is the feeling that the outsiders are lookiing at the folks belonging to that interesting culture as though they were critters on displkay in cages in a zoo. Oh, look at the quaint Amish guy with buggy and beard. OK, now lets go home to Cleveland and buy our Starbucks latte.
However, should I have to live in W. Va. and have to make a choice between making my living selling my culture to tourists or working in a coal mine, you know which would win. I no like dark holes in the ground.
Why cannot pass a law that no more new residents to Hawai`i? If they are talking about immigration reform along the Mexico border, perhaps need similar for Hawai`i. The islands are only so big and can only sustain a set number of people. Why not legislation that one has to be a state resident to purchase land? That all goes back to the great mahele, no? Seems to me that is when the real pilikia began.
How much land does Bishop Trust own? What do they do with it? |
Me ke aloha
Malama pono,
Wanda |
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Kapila Kane
Ha`aha`a
USA
1051 Posts |
Posted - 01/11/2008 : 07:42:40 AM
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I was afraid I was just venting (or is it vente?).
Many difficulties...
but there is tremendous good down here too...
All of us...even the rich!
besides, compared to so many in the world, we are all relatively rich.
I like the commercial where one kind, considerate act is passed to the next person as we go...we can affect the script.
For myself, keeping and improving good PUBLIC EDUCATION seems one of the cornerstones of hope...
a better world is better for rich and poor, and also for the few of us still left in the middle!
The slogan here in Colorado during the now slithering "never tax, no spending please" reign of error, was,
"We've FULLY-FUNDED education in Colorado." which was a dance of numbers at best...
the new management has their hands full, and we have the Tabor Ammendment, which has really screwed up anything that requires funding...but there's move to actually fund problems our sacred tests have mapped but not fixed.
Taxes and governments aren't necessarily evil--and as far as I can see, necessary!
I like to have better public schools, (some would like to see them disappear), decent roads (in the right places), schools, schools, schools, cleaner air, water, and land, maybe a park or two, and more lands that are public, access to higher education, armed forces that are used wisely, treated with respect and rewarded when they return to society...true support (not just another lame slogan)...
Oh, and perhaps, if there's a penny or two left...CULTURE!
One of my friends claims the reason we haole yuppies love art openings and buy the latest fashions and art is we need some culture..we ain't got one... except of course,
Our Lady of Perpetual Absurd Consumption...
Not that's a little cynical, but ain't it the truth, ain't it the truth?!
The problem is, I am haole, living a touch yupped-up myself, and, of course would like to live in Hawaii.
But,
"I'm good enough, I'm smart enough, and gosh-darn it, people like me!"
Well maybe.
Oh wait, this is a site for loving Hawaii...not so much complain....
Vente's Inferno |
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