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dfpet
Aloha
USA
45 Posts |
 Posted - 04/28/2008 : 05:36:53 AM
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Just wondering if anyone has the lyrics and chords for the song Kealohalani. Mahalo, Diana
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Diana |
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hapakid
Luna Ho`omalu
USA
1533 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2008 : 12:36:32 PM
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My friend, Dr. Cookie, and I love this song but can't find the lyrics either. Here's what we think the words may be, just from listening to Maunalua's version:
Kealohalani
By George Manoa Huddy
Auhea wale 'oe, Kealohalani,
I mana'o i 'ia 'oe poina'ole.
Ua lohe 'i ane'i o ke hala lani
i kapa 'ia a'o nani me ka ua noe.
He aloha no 'ia oe, ka puuwai (hawana? ha mama????)
e kilohi i ka nani puni i kaua.
Me ke kai hawanawana, i ka po me ke ao,
ho'oolu ana i ke kai poina'ole.
Ha'ina mai ka puana, Kealohalani,
I mana'o ia 'oe, pili no kaua.
This may make no sense at all, but it's close to what we're hearing. All help appreciated.
Jesse Tinsley
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dfpet
Aloha
USA
45 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2008 : 4:02:00 PM
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Mahalo, mahalo, mahalo..... I'll listen to the Maunalua CD and see if I can make it out also. I have listened many times, but just couldn't get it. Now with this start, I may get it!!!
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dfpet
Aloha
USA
45 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2008 : 6:08:00 PM
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Well, I listened to two versions of this song: one sung by Kai Kamalani and another by Bobby Moderow. The version by Kai Kamalani was on a CD called Kihoalu No Ka Oi and it has a few different words and is missing two verses. So, I'll go with the Bobby Moderow version and my impression is you are definitely pretty close. I heard a few words differently, but will keep listening to it until I get it. Again, Mahalo for the input; it really helped. I just need to figure out the chords now. I think he is playing in G, so that's a start. Any input on that will be much appreciated too. |
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hapakid
Luna Ho`omalu
USA
1533 Posts |
Posted - 04/29/2008 : 08:33:57 AM
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Please post the lyrics again when you've edited it yourself. We can't be too far off!
Jesse Tinsley |
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jlsulle
Lokahi
USA
284 Posts |
Posted - 04/29/2008 : 10:42:41 AM
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Jesse and Diana,
Great song. I put the song in the "slowdowner" and I think the words you have are all correct. In the third verse I am sure it is "ha mama". The song is in the key of G. I don't have the chords in yet but I can play along. It is mainly just G,C,and D7 with an Eb here and there. Jerry |
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hapuna
Lokahi
USA
159 Posts |
Posted - 05/03/2008 : 08:37:14 AM
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OK guys I really think the best version to parse the words is on the Hui Ohana version from the Pau Hana CD. I think you have most of it but there are a lot of little problems in your transliteration. Oddly the part you question appears to right on. Here are some but not all of the corrections I hear.
Auhea wale 'oe, Kealohalani,
I mana'o 'ia 'oe poina'ole. Took out the extra "i"
Ua lohe 'i ane'i o ke hala lani
i kapa 'ia a'o nani me ka ua noe.
He aloha no 'ia oe, a ka puuwai ha mama Added an "a" to second part
e kilohe i ka nani puni i kaua. Changed kilohi to he. Kaua sounds like kalua to me
Me ke kai hawanawana, i ka po me ke ao,
ho'oolu ana i ke kai poina'ole.
Ha'ina mai ka puana, Kealohalani,
I mana'o ia 'oe, pili no kaua. Same issue with this kaua
Those are the main(though maybe not all) of the difference I found
The Hui Ohana version is very clear so listen to it if you can |
hapuna
Seattle |
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noeau
Ha`aha`a
USA
1105 Posts |
Posted - 05/03/2008 : 11:51:36 AM
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| I haven't heard the song in all its versions. But just looking at the context of the verses some words may be still mispelled. For example the word iā as opposed to ʻia. ʻia makes a verb passive if for example aloha were to be written as a passive verb then the phrase: He aloha no ia ʻoe must be written: he aloha ʻia nō. Then ʻoe would be rather awkward. Therefore the ʻokina should be dropped and the phrase would be: He aloha nō iā ʻoe. That would apply to the line I manaʻo iā ʻoe as well. The word kilohe does not exist therefore kilohi is perhaps the correct spelling. Kāua is a personal pronoun meaning us two or the two of us. So kalua would render the sentence meaningless. So I humbly submit that the line E kilohi i ka nani puni i kāua might mean: Gaze at the beauty that surrounds us. Pronunciation is a difficult thing. Try to remember that most modern musicians are not native speakers so their singing wonʻt always reflect the language and its myriad sounds. I am not I hope being critical. I just want to illustrate the difficulty of trying to discern lyrics from recordings this is especially true if one is not well versed in the language. It is very difficult to hear all the nuances of ʻōlelo Hawaii. Donʻt stop trying though the more anyone does the better they get. |
No'eau, eia au he mea pa'ani wale nō. |
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hapuna
Lokahi
USA
159 Posts |
Posted - 05/03/2008 : 2:53:14 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by noeau
I haven't heard the song in all its versions. But just looking at the context of the verses some words may be still mispelled. For example the word iā as opposed to ʻia. ʻia makes a verb passive if for example aloha were to be written as a passive verb then the phrase: He aloha no ia ʻoe must be written: he aloha ʻia nō. Then ʻoe would be rather awkward. Therefore the ʻokina should be dropped and the phrase would be: He aloha nō iā ʻoe. That would apply to the line I manaʻo iā ʻoe as well. The word kilohe does not exist therefore kilohi is perhaps the correct spelling. Kāua is a personal pronoun meaning us two or the two of us. So kalua would render the sentence meaningless. So I humbly submit that the line E kilohi i ka nani puni i kāua might mean: Gaze at the beauty that surrounds us. Pronunciation is a difficult thing. Try to remember that most modern musicians are not native speakers so their singing wonʻt always reflect the language and its myriad sounds. I am not I hope being critical. I just want to illustrate the difficulty of trying to discern lyrics from recordings this is especially true if one is not well versed in the language. It is very difficult to hear all the nuances of ʻōlelo Hawaii. Donʻt stop trying though the more anyone does the better they get.
Yes and I must say I was simply listening and getting the verse that way not by way of meaning. |
hapuna
Seattle |
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hapakid
Luna Ho`omalu
USA
1533 Posts |
Posted - 05/03/2008 : 4:01:40 PM
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Mahalo for chiming in, Noeau!
Jesse Tinsley |
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hwnmusiclives
`Olu`olu
USA
580 Posts |
Posted - 05/05/2008 : 04:04:10 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by noeau
I haven't heard the song in all its versions. But just looking at the context of the verses some words may be still mispelled. For example the word iā as opposed to ʻia. ʻia makes a verb passive if for example aloha were to be written as a passive verb then the phrase: He aloha no ia ʻoe must be written: he aloha ʻia nō. Then ʻoe would be rather awkward. Therefore the ʻokina should be dropped and the phrase would be: He aloha nō iā ʻoe. That would apply to the line I manaʻo iā ʻoe as well. The word kilohe does not exist therefore kilohi is perhaps the correct spelling. Kāua is a personal pronoun meaning us two or the two of us. So kalua would render the sentence meaningless. So I humbly submit that the line E kilohi i ka nani puni i kāua might mean: Gaze at the beauty that surrounds us. Pronunciation is a difficult thing. Try to remember that most modern musicians are not native speakers so their singing wonʻt always reflect the language and its myriad sounds. I am not I hope being critical. I just want to illustrate the difficulty of trying to discern lyrics from recordings this is especially true if one is not well versed in the language. It is very difficult to hear all the nuances of ʻōlelo Hawaii. Donʻt stop trying though the more anyone does the better they get.
Noeau makes some excellent points, but I don't necessarily agree with the last. In fact, I was a little troubled by the nature of the entire thread. Even as we strive to hear these nuances in the language so that our performance becomes more accurate, this should not be the key to helping us decipher the lyrics of a song because the ears deceive.
How does someone become inspired to perform a song that they do not understand the meaning behind? This is a common misstep among young performers of Hawaiian music. How many times have the kupuna said to me, "The song is not a vehicle for your vocal acrobatics. It is a story. If you don't know the story, you can't interpret the story, so don't sing the song."
It's admirable to try to get the lyrics right to sing the song, but if we're inspired to sing the song because it has a pretty melody or because it really shows off our voice, perhaps we've chosen the song for the wrong reason.
But if we're going to attempt to go about this pono, why "make A" by trying to work out the song phonetically? Even collaboratively we have less than a 50% chance of getting it perfect, and I would not be caught dead singing a song in public that I did not know - really know.
You can get this lyric by calling the Bishop Museum Archives. Ask for Betty or Desoto. They can put their fingers on it in seconds and they will charge you $1 a page for photocopying plus postage. You will get a translation by someone we trust (often Kimo Alama Keaulana). And you will be able to sing the song with confidence and conviction.
You have to really appreciate Noeau's post because it clearly demonstrates the intricacies of deciphering lyrics phonetically - in any language. (Case in point: The classic misconstrued lyric from Purple Haze, "Excuse me while I kiss this guy.") The meaning conveyed from mispronunciation can be embarrassing. (In my case - one of many I can recall, actually - it was a diatribe from Aunty Emma Ako on the difference between "Ha`ina ia mai" and "Ha`ina ia ma`i.") There are numerous posts in this thread which attempt to string together the correct-yet-seemingly-meaningless syllables. Not until Noeau's thread did I see an attempt at translating these syllables into a story. That is disturbing. "Sounds like this," "sounds more like that," or "I don't hear an L in there" becomes folly if we know what the song means; if we know what the song means, the words fall right into place.
I am not chastizing. I am not manaleo and I do not even speak the language. I am - like many of us here - one who struggles to get it right every time I sing. But I have taken my lumps for trying to do things that I hadn't considered the negative ramifications of, and one of those is transcribing lyrics from recordings. When you do this, you take for granted that the recording is accurate, too. The groups we cherish, admire, and respect didn't always get it right. (Listen to Hui `Ohana's "Pua Ahihi" which contains at least one mistake per verse or the Brothers Cazimero's first attempt at "Morning Dew" which - by Robert's own admission - was wrong throughout.) Admittedly, I have enjoyed being corrected by a Genoa Keawe or an Eddie Kamae because it means that they were listening and that they care. And as long as they are willing to scold, I am willing to learn. When they stop correcting, it doesn't mean you got it perfect, but more likely means that they have given up on you...
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Join me for the history of Hawaiian music and its musicians at Ho`olohe Hou at www.hoolohehou.org. |
Edited by - hwnmusiclives on 05/05/2008 07:26:00 AM |
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hapuna
Lokahi
USA
159 Posts |
Posted - 05/05/2008 : 09:15:24 AM
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Though I agree with everything hwn say we are stuck with the practical issue of getting lyrics to songs we enjoy whether we know/understand what the meaning is or not. As you know in Hawaiian poetry/music, the meaning of the words may not be the meaning of the song. So should we just not engage cause we don't have it all?? I too want to know the correct words and the correct meaning/feeling of every song. I do think that can be a process which we learn and discover. Of course I would never perform something in public without having done all the work described above but as a start getting the pieces together as best one can would seem to be a good place to start. Its always nice when the words/meanings are in liner notes but that is rare nowadays.
Anyway I would not discourage anyone from trying to get the words etc. but take into account the work that needs to be done by the previous post. |
hapuna
Seattle |
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noeau
Ha`aha`a
USA
1105 Posts |
Posted - 05/05/2008 : 8:53:42 PM
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| Donʻt anyone take this the wrong way. This is just me. I wanted to be accurate and respectful to the music and the culture so I went and got a degree in the language. No brag just fact. I was brought up to do the things I should do and to do them as correctly as possible. So if any one is serious about learning the lyrics to a song they can find the accurate lyrics if they want to. The suggestion of checking with Bishop Museum is an excellent one. There are many teachers at UH Mānoa and UH Hilo that can be contacted as well. As Mary Pukuʻi said: "Nānā i ke kumu". It really is that simple. As for my last post I spoke out saying that practice makes perfect. I listened to manaleo for over 500 hours on tapes that are available to the public and the more I listened the better I got at discerning what words were being said. That is what i meant by encouraging everyone to not get discouraged and to holomua. |
No'eau, eia au he mea pa'ani wale nō. |
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wcerto
Ahonui
USA
5052 Posts |
Posted - 05/06/2008 : 01:31:10 AM
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And do not forget that we have many friends here on Taro Patch who are willing to kokua. That is why Diana posted her question in the first place. That is why so many people come to Taro Patch. There hear from a friend of a friend or whatever that if you need to know something about Hawaiian music, you can probably find the answer at the Taro Patch. We have so many people who are expert in so many areas -- `olelo, guitar, steel, `ukulele, sound, etc.
Bill did a great service by reminding us of the importance of honoring the words. Al did us a great service by reminding us to malama the language.
There are songs that catch your ear for whatever reason. Or catch your heart. As one who is not a Hawaiian speaker, I struggle to find out the meanings to songs that I have an interest in. There are indeed many resources to find out. I have definitely found that trying to learn from the recordings is not an accurate way of doing so. There are very few songs recorded by differing artists who are exactly the same when it comes to language. Moreover, just because you are certain of what you heard, does not mean it is the correct thing. Many times when singing a word, the kahako is ignored for the correct vowel and emphasis is placed on a different syllable of the word to make it fit in with the meter of the song. Just last night at hula practice, I discovered in Bros. Cazimero "Aloha Kaua`i", there is a line that says, "Puana, kaulana ka inoa o Kaua`i". Robert sings "kainoa" all pushed together like that so it sounds like: ky-noah. Trouble is, so many songs, we do not know how the haku mele intended them. It is hard enough to find lyrics, but musical notation - probably not much available. |
Me ke aloha
Malama pono,
Wanda |
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Retro
Ahonui
USA
2368 Posts |
Posted - 05/06/2008 : 06:40:27 AM
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Word to all recording artists: Please include lyric sheets with your CDs.
See how easy this would be to resolve?
(Oh wait --- there are some cases that I've seen where songs and chants are included that are proprietary to the artist's family...so much for simplicity.) |
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hwnmusiclives
`Olu`olu
USA
580 Posts |
Posted - 05/06/2008 : 07:12:43 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Retro
Word to all recording artists: Please include lyric sheets with your CDs.
See how easy this would be to resolve?
(Oh wait --- there are some cases that I've seen where songs and chants are included that are proprietary to the artist's family...so much for simplicity.)
Today, my pet peeve is not lyrics, but rather melody and chords. I am rehearsing Po La`ila`i (among other songs) to perform with local hula dancers. I was given the recording they learned from - by `Ale`a - and I listened to it quickly and said, "Is this the recording the rest of the band has been learning from?" When they said that it was, I said, "Well, that sucks because it's wrong."
I then compared any number of other recordings of the same song: `Ale`a, Lim Family, Raiatea Helm... All were wrong in precisely the same way - proof that we are handing down wrong information from one to another. Who got it right? Marlene Sai and Ipo Kumukahi.
This is the way `Ale`a performed it:
G______________C______________G
Kâua i ka holoholo i ka pô mahina la`ila`i
E7________A7__D7_____________G
E kilo ho`onanea i nâ hôkû o ka lani
Here is the correct harmonic structure:
G______________C_______________G
Kâua i ka holoholo i ka pô mahina la`ila`i
B7________Em A7 D7_________G
E kilo ho`onanea i nâ hôkû o ka lani
The latter is much more complex harmonically. That is the way the composer intended it. Maddy Lam was one of the jazziest writers in the history of Hawaiian music. She wrote these beautiful chord changes, and a few generations later, we have simplified them... And why? Because they're easier to teach? They're easier to remember? I don't know.
When asked how I knew my version was correct, I refused to swear by it but instead played the recording I transcribed it from: the 1956 recording supervised by the composer, Maddy Lam.
There is an inherent danger in learning only from the recordings. When we do this, we take it for granted that the performer has done their homework and that simply may not be the case.
I did not respond previously to hapuna because I do not wish to incite a riot. But I can honestly say I did not understand the idea of "songs we enjoy whether we know/understand what the meaning is or not." Hawaiian music is an oral tradition. I don't know how one can claim to enjoy the song without knowing the meaning of the song. To me, this is akin to judging a book by its cover or a painting by its fancy gilded frame. The content of Hawaiian music is the words. So I respectfully disagree with the assertion that "the meaning of the words may not be the meaning of the song." The song may have numerous meanings that lend themselves to numerous post-structuralist interpretations - that is, those the composer intended plus those we find in the poetry because of our own unique experiences which we bring to bear as we listen. But no level of meaning is possible without having the words right first. No matter what secondary and tertiary meanings one may find in the lyric, that is only possible when the literal lyric is accurate.
Don't believe me? Ask your hula dancer...
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Join me for the history of Hawaiian music and its musicians at Ho`olohe Hou at www.hoolohehou.org. |
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