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cpatch
Ahonui
USA
2187 Posts |
 Posted - 06/03/2003 : 6:02:04 PM
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Well, it only took me 6 months or so, but I finally learned my second slack key song: Manuela Boy. For some reason my brain just couldn't wrap itself around this song...I could play it from the tab but couldn't memorize it, and I can't play something with aloha unless I have it memorized. But persistence finally paid off and I just wanted to share this little breakthrough with everyone, especially for the sake of anyone else who may be struggling with a song.
I also got Molehu memorized at the same time, but need to work on a few of the chord transitions. (I almost have a repertoire!) Next up I think I'm going to take a shot at Keith Marzullo's beautiful arrangement of Lahainaluna that he recorded for the TaroPatch CD and was gracious enough to share with me.
What's everyone else working on?
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Craig
My goal is to be able to play as well as people think I can. |
Edited by - cpatch on 06/03/2003 7:04:20 PM |
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Fran Guidry
Ha`aha`a
USA
1579 Posts |
Posted - 06/03/2003 : 6:29:21 PM
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I was so excited when I learned "Manuela Boy" because it was a "real" song and not an etude. It was also the first slack key piece where I found my own variation. Try humming the melody and picking the G chord at the 7-8-9 fret and the D chord at 7. I bet you'll find the same variation I did <grin>.
"Molehu" is a lovely piece and lots of fun to find variations and play duets on, or pass around at a kanikapila.
You're on your way, C.
Fran
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E ho`okani pila kakou ma Kaleponi
Slack Key Guitar in California - www.kaleponi.com
Slack Key on YouTube
Homebrewed Music Blog |
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cdyas
Akahai
67 Posts |
Posted - 06/03/2003 : 6:32:18 PM
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Great job Craig.
How did you work through it? I have a hard time memorizing songs myself and trying to find differnt ways to work through this issue. It has been helpful for me to be working on a couple of songs at a time. I choose a song, practice with the tab and then take breaks trying to play a different song until I get stuck and then go back to the song that is in front of me. It feels less frustrating than just working on one song and getting stuck at the same place, and has helped free me from feeling like I had to have the music in front of me but i am willling to try anything. |
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cpatch
Ahonui
USA
2187 Posts |
Posted - 06/03/2003 : 7:02:52 PM
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Thanks Fran!
Cdyas...the first thing I do is listen to a recording of the song until I can know what it should sound like. This helps me get the timing right and also makes it easier to identify and correct mistakes. Then I just practice with the tab, working on a few measures at a time until I can play comfortably with the tab. The next step is to work on memorizing the tab, again a few measures at a time, until I can play the whole song through without the tab. Then I work on any trouble spots until I can play through the song from start to finish smoothly at a slow tempo. The last step is to work up to full tempo.
I also like to work on a couple of songs at a time, for the same reasons you mention. (Which is why I ended up getting Manuela Boy and Molehu memorized around the same time.) What's interesting (to me at least) is that some some songs just "make more sense" to me than others in terms of their structure, which is why I was able to memorize Molehu much faster than Manuela Boy. On the other hand, once I memorized Manuela Boy I was able to play it fairly smoothly, while Molehu is more challenging for me as far as the fingering is concerned.
Anyway, blah blah blah. I hope some of this blabbering was useful or at least interesting. |
Craig
My goal is to be able to play as well as people think I can. |
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marzullo
`Olu`olu
USA
923 Posts |
Posted - 06/03/2003 : 8:36:08 PM
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allright craig!!   
manuela boy is a good one - it gets you into the swing of singing and playing at the same time, which is part of slack key that i love (umm, perhaps more than the neighbors and my fellow players love  )
thanks for the kind words about lahainaluna - as you work on it, don't be afraid to modify it to make it personal. my version is a modification of bill pellazar's version, and i know that bill will be happy too if you keep it growing.
i'm working on ku'u lei awapuhi (it's pretty simple), vaya con dios (kevin brown makes it look simple  , trying to piece together ed kalama's yellow bird, and kaulana bay.
i need voice lessons, though.
aloha, and see you on monday? |
Keith |
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RJS
Ha`aha`a
1635 Posts |
Posted - 06/03/2003 : 8:42:46 PM
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Craig,
Congratulations,
I remember the thrill of working through Ozzie's book - how good it felt to learn each successive song.
I hear that you feel you need to memorize to play with Aloha. I just want to keep reminding people that memorizing is not essentially a musical skill. Being able to put life into a song is. Many years ago when I was playing proffesionally - not guitar - the whole band, except the percussion guys - used fake books. Many of my friends are classical musicians - they almost never play by memory, but play beautifully and expressively. If memorizing helps you to get to an expressive place -- great. I hate to see people who could otherwise play very well struggle with memorization and think that they are somehow less good as musicians.
What I'm working on -- Just finishing an arrangement of Love Song of Kahlua, thinking of having a go at 'Ahi Wela. Right now, though, most of my time is devoted to working up a dozen Latin songs for a gig at the end of the month, and trying to finish up the never ending first CD project.
Congrats, again,
Raymond
San jose |
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Admin
Pupule
USA
4551 Posts |
Posted - 06/03/2003 : 10:18:26 PM
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Way to go Craig! Thanks for sharing your excitement and progress.
Ozzie's book was "the book" where I finally started to "get" the songs. I'll be honest too - there is a song or two that I never got to yet. Keep telling myself to get back to it but time just flies.quote:
What's everyone else working on?
My guitar is back in taro patch after being in standard preparing for the Japan Festival. Played a couple Hapa songs and one Kalapana song. It was fun. Think I could use some singing lessons though.
Tonight, I sat down and tried getting back to slack key so that I do not look like an idiot in Maui later this month. Sat down trying to remember what's in my repertoire and tried getting back to finger picking.
I'm hoping to make a Waihee jam but only have one Saturday and George's camp is going on at the same time. I have to figure out how to fit it in! |
Andy |
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cpatch
Ahonui
USA
2187 Posts |
Posted - 06/03/2003 : 11:36:30 PM
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Hey, thanks for the encouragement everybody; I really appreciate it.
Keith, I haven't attempted to sing and play at the same time yet...I hadn't even thought of it to tell you the truth. My voice isn't too bad (I sing better than I play), so I'll definitely put in on my to-do list! It sounds like you have your hands full with all the stuff you're working on. I can't wait to hear it. I'm not going to be able to make the meeting on Monday...I'll be in San Francisco all next week at a nerd convention (JavaOne). I am planning on getting together with Patrick Landeza Tuesday night though, so that will be my replacement meeting!
Raymond, I understand and appreciate what you're saying. At this point in my musical journey I just haven't learned the skills I need to venture beyond memorization. What little instruction I've had over the years has always been in fingerstyle and learning tab...I very little chord knowledge (especially in slack key tunings) and even less music theory. I hope to correct that at some point, but right now I'm getting a lot of enjoyment out of building a repertoire, and the more I learn the more comfortable I become with just "messing" around. |
Craig
My goal is to be able to play as well as people think I can. |
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chunky monkey
Ha`aha`a
USA
1021 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2003 : 01:06:35 AM
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Patch,
Ho`omaika`i. Try playing a song in reverse order of measures (e.g. play the last measure first, second to last second and so on. Someone told me it's a good way to help memorize a song; it has something with the way the brain remembers. I'll expect to hear this song at the next meeting. Keith's version of Lahainaluna is a winner. I've got it down, if I don't choke in front of an audience. Also, try Dusty's (via Hal Kinneman and Doug McMasters) version of Hula medley. That's a fun song that you can learn to play fast. I combined Keith's version with Dusty's and can drag it out a while. It's a good exercise for developing turn-arounds. At the next meeting, I'll show you what I mean.
Also, Patrick's PiliPuka that YOU tabbed is pretty easy and a great listening tune. It also has the potential to add your own tricks. The tab helps a lot. Mahalo.
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RJS
Ha`aha`a
1635 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2003 : 02:28:40 AM
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The real reason for working backwards isn't because the brain works that way - it comes from learning theory -- very simple actually - if you are always working towards what you already know, you get reinforced when you get there - this "rewareds" your new learning, helping to solidy it. Also, on a practical level, it prevent learning the beginnings of a lot of songs, but never learning the endings.
Raymond |
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Pauline Leland
`Olu`olu
USA
783 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2003 : 10:57:27 AM
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Craig,
Congrats! And thanks for inspiration. I get so impatient.
You asked what everybody is working on. I've been working on ukulele almost exclusively for the better part of a year. Last week I tried guitar again, it sounds so rich after ukulele, even found a teacher, but I'm back at "Kani Ki Ho`alu". Doing both.
Raymond,
That's very interesting! I've noticed, too, that arrangements usually start simple and grow more complex. I start with "I can do this" and end with "Whoa! Where did that come from?" If you start at the end of a typical piece, you'll be playing through the tough stuff more often that the easy parts. Accomplishing that is a reward.
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Pauline |
Edited by - Pauline Leland on 06/04/2003 3:20:05 PM |
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Stacey
Lokahi
USA
169 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2003 : 12:39:36 PM
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Aloha Craig and Congratulations on learning your second song!!! I had a tough time learning Manuela Boy too ~ it's tricky, but FUN! Ozzie's book is just the best!
I'm working on Nanea Kou Maka I Ka Le`ale`a by Ray Kane out of Mark Hanson's Masters of Hawaiian Slack Key Guitar Book. I've almost got it! I'm like you Craig, I do much better with a song if I've got it memorized.
I had a lesson with Raymond a month ago and he gave me some wonderful advice for putting Aloha into your songs. Now if I could only really do it ~ hee hee! Ya see, I have trouble not playing like a metronome. He suggested that I hum or sing the song the way I want it to sound because one doesn't usually sing like a metronome. I have found this tremendously helpful cuz I can even do it in the car ~ that's where I do most of my singing. Mahalo, Raymond!
I'm going to try that playing the measures in reverse order to help memorize the song ~ Mahalo for the tip, Chunky Monkey, and for the insight, Raymond. Great Idea!
I'd be very interested in learning Lahainaluna too, Keith. |
Edited by - Stacey on 06/04/2003 12:44:51 PM |
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ongchua
Akahai
USA
92 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2003 : 1:18:10 PM
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WTG Craig! Congratulations!
I've still got a ways to go before I get to Kani Ki Ho'alu; but I'll get there. I'm still keeping online notes of my progress on my homepage blog. (If I'm not mistaken, Zig Ziglar had suggested that one way to incent oneself towards a goal was to make it visible to the world.) |
Edited by - ongchua on 06/04/2003 1:32:26 PM |
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cpatch
Ahonui
USA
2187 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2003 : 1:32:00 PM
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Thanks again everyone. I'm going to try the tips that you all suggested and also keep working on Pilipuka as well...I forgot I'd started on that one!
Dusty, do you have your own tab for Hula Medley, or is it the same as the one in Hal's book? |
Craig
My goal is to be able to play as well as people think I can. |
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Mark
Ha`aha`a
USA
1628 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2003 : 2:52:54 PM
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Hey, great thread! Sharing info on how to learn is so valuable.
Like a lot of folks, I learned the "Hula Medley" from Hal. He's got it tabbed out, and all the versions I've heard (including some on various CDs) seem to derive from his tab. A fun bunch of tunes..
Does anyone know the origin of this medley? It's pretty close to something Gabby Pahinui plays on that video that's going around...
Is it recorded anywhere? Anyone know the names of the tunes?
Happy playing!
Mark |
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cpatch
Ahonui
USA
2187 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2003 : 3:06:11 PM
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Hula Medley was originally recorded in the late '40s on two separate 78s, one by Gabby (1947) and one by Mike Ho`omanawanui (194?). Gabby's version consists of three songs: Nani Wale Lihu`e, Wai`alae, and Halona and is also the only solo instrumental recording he did. Mike's version is completely different and very close to the version Hal does but without Salomila (the only song I can identify in Hal's version).
Hal's version appears to be a completely different, but obviously musically related song called Old Timer's Hula, which was originally recorded by Tommy Solomon in 1946. In fact the McMasters recorded the song as Old Timer's Hula.
If you're interested in doing your own comparison, all three of the '40s recordings appear on The History of Slack Key Guitar.) |
Craig
My goal is to be able to play as well as people think I can. |
Edited by - cpatch on 06/04/2003 5:38:19 PM |
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