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TerryLiberty
Lokahi
USA
207 Posts |
 Posted - 11/15/2011 : 10:38:38 AM
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Folks:
Hard for a haole like me to put these songs and their history into true perspective since I've never had my culture taken away. I know I'll not hear another slack-key song without remembering that it contains much heritage both captured and lost.
Thanks for the references.
Terry
Olympia, WA |
Terry
Olympia, WA
Forever a haumana |
Edited by - TerryLiberty on 11/15/2011 1:30:34 PM |
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thumbstruck
Ahonui
USA
2165 Posts |
Posted - 11/15/2011 : 9:02:47 PM
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| The history of humankind will never fail to supply opportunties for protest, complaint, or outcry. Ignorance, ineptitude, and selfishness get in the way of good relations. |
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ricdoug
`Olu`olu
USA
513 Posts |
Posted - 11/16/2011 : 3:24:08 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by ypochris
Obviously- he was wearing his "occupy" tee shirt.
Your point?
Planned and blessed by the current administration. That's the obvious in my opinion. Ric |
It's easier to ask for forgiveness, than permission! |
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ypochris
Lokahi
USA
398 Posts |
Posted - 11/16/2011 : 4:11:09 PM
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"Planned and blessed by the current administration."
Why? |
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ricdoug
`Olu`olu
USA
513 Posts |
Posted - 11/16/2011 : 6:16:53 PM
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| It's their current strategy platform. My opinion. Ric |
It's easier to ask for forgiveness, than permission! |
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ypochris
Lokahi
USA
398 Posts |
Posted - 11/16/2011 : 9:16:29 PM
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Although the goals of OWS are different depending on who you talk to, in general:
OWS is calling for an end to political corruption and politics as usual, including the Democratic and Republican parties- Obama is part of that system.
OWS is calling for an end to corporate personhood and money equaling speech- Obama stands to receive massive advertising as a result of this ruling.
OWS calls for public funding of campaigns- no private money allowed. Obama is the first to decline public funding in the general election.
OWS calls for the breakup of large financial institutions- Obama bailed out favored institutions while allowing equally large but less well connected institutions to fail.
OWS says Earth before profit- Obama is considered the worst president for the environment in modern times.
OWS is opposed to the greed of the "1%"- Obama is one of the 1%, and his policies favor the 1%- government of, by, and for the corporations.
OWS calls for higher taxes on the rich- Obama has talked that talk, but when it came down to it he extended the Bush tax cuts in exchange for unemployment benefits worth a third as much.
OWS calls for single payer health care. Obama instituted mandatory health insurance, ensuring profit to those who provide no health services and higher costs for the poor.
And on and on. I fail to see how the goals of the OWS movement and the Obama administration align in any way.
(When I say "Obama" here, of course I generally mean the Obama administration.)
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markwitz
`Olu`olu
USA
841 Posts |
Posted - 11/17/2011 : 03:42:58 AM
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If anyone is interested in hearing Makana's interview on Sean Hannity's radio progrm. Click on this link.
http://www.ksfo560.com/Article.asp?id=534876
Select Wednesday.
Select 1 - 2 PM. The interview starts around 6:45. It will be up for 7 days. |
"The music of the Hawaiians, the most fascinating in the world, is still in my ears and
haunts me sleeping and waking."
Mark Twain |
Edited by - markwitz on 11/17/2011 04:35:45 AM |
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Mike Anderson
Akahai
Canada
84 Posts |
Posted - 11/18/2011 : 10:41:51 AM
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You don't even wanna know what I think of Occupy. Here in Vancouver it's the usual gang of Marxists-on-welfare (you tell ME how you can be all about the struggle of the proletariat when you've never held an actual job in your life). There've been two heroin ODs, one fatal, in their grungy tent city downtown on public land - and if you go to their website you discover they haven't even worked out what it is they're demanding yet after a month.
Listening to Makana...sounds like just another typical ignorant young artist's worldview, and he hasn't actually thought about it enough to defend it articulately.
At the end of the day, growing in an environment saturated in four decades of ubiquitous Marxist propaganda is going to have a profound effect. If you actually believe that rich people are somehow magically preventing other people from making money themselves and even becoming rich themselves, your understanding of economics froze in adolescence thanks to that propaganda.
Nuff said. |
It's never too late to have a happy childhood! |
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ypochris
Lokahi
USA
398 Posts |
Posted - 11/19/2011 : 04:29:03 AM
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Interesting survey results:
Number of OWS protesters with jobs- 70%
Number of people who consider themselves members of the Tea Party with jobs- 54%
Make of it what you will...
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cmdrpiffle
`Olu`olu
USA
553 Posts |
Posted - 11/20/2011 : 07:00:43 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Mike Anderson
You don't even wanna know what I think of Occupy. Here in Vancouver it's the usual gang of Marxists-on-welfare (you tell ME how you can be all about the struggle of the proletariat when you've never held an actual job in your life). There've been two heroin ODs, one fatal, in their grungy tent city downtown on public land - and if you go to their website you discover they haven't even worked out what it is they're demanding yet after a month.
Listening to Makana...sounds like just another typical ignorant young artist's worldview, and he hasn't actually thought about it enough to defend it articulately.
At the end of the day, growing in an environment saturated in four decades of ubiquitous Marxist propaganda is going to have a profound effect. If you actually believe that rich people are somehow magically preventing other people from making money themselves and even becoming rich themselves, your understanding of economics froze in adolescence thanks to that propaganda.
Nuff said.
Couldn't have said it better myself. In Santa Cruz, just up the number of heroin ODs and it sounds pretty similar.
Cheers
Mike |
my Poodle is smarter than your honor student |
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Mike Anderson
Akahai
Canada
84 Posts |
Posted - 11/20/2011 : 10:14:10 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by ypochris
Interesting survey results:
Number of OWS protesters with jobs- 70%
Number of people who consider themselves members of the Tea Party with jobs- 54%
Make of it what you will...
Very different story here, I promise you.
@ Mike - thanx man. Over half a century of existence and a finely tuned BS detector has given me some perspective. :)
Interesting note: Friday the City finally got around to issuing a notice that the campers need to clear out by tomorrow at 2 PM. Several spokespersons have already gone public saying they will not leave voluntarily. In other words, they are shortly going to get their wish: being forcibly removed by police. This will give them their usual opportunity to scream about their rights being violated; if they fight and get clobbered, they get to add "police brutality", another favorite complaint. How boring, and how predictable.
It must be sheer hell, truly, to live your whole life so totally bounded and defined by entrenched unexamined biases; to see the world as awful and corrupt and to ignore and even revile goodness; and in the end, to not have the honesty to admit they alone are the source of their own failure to succeed in life, and to not have the foresight to predict their own inevitable lonely premature death in a welfare hotel or a gutter. :( |
It's never too late to have a happy childhood! |
Edited by - Mike Anderson on 11/20/2011 10:27:04 AM |
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wcerto
Ahonui
USA
5052 Posts |
Posted - 11/20/2011 : 12:39:49 PM
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Finally I am going to chime in about the topic of Makana's "protest": the interview did so much more to tell us what Makana really knows about what he was protesting. It made him sound like exactly what I expected.
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Me ke aloha
Malama pono,
Wanda |
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ypochris
Lokahi
USA
398 Posts |
Posted - 11/20/2011 : 5:26:33 PM
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"It must be sheer hell, truly, to live your whole life so totally bounded and defined by entrenched unexamined biases; to see the world as awful and corrupt and to ignore and even revile goodness; and in the end, to not have the honesty to admit they alone are the source of their own failure to succeed in life, and to not have the foresight to predict their own inevitable lonely premature death in a welfare hotel or a gutter."
Funny, talking about unexamined biases just before exposing some of your own.
Although OWS protesters have a variety of personal agendas, there is an overall theme- the pervasive influence of money in politics corrupting true democracy into a vehicle where the government channels an ever increasing percentage of the nation's (world's) wealth into the hands of a very few who already have more than they can possibly use.
Everyone knows our representatives in government are utterly beholden to the special interests who paid to get them into office. Fighting to eliminate legalized bribery does not, to me, seem like such a bad idea.
Now, about biases and stereotypes- I was going to join a OWS protest on Thursday, but the one nearby started after five, because no one could show up on a weekday until after work. I did do a drive by, and it was all nice cars and nicely dressed people. Of course, this was a support rally, not an occupation- I'm sure the long term camps, particularly in cities, tend to draw primarily those with nothing better to do, including users and abusers. And, of course (from what I'm told), their share of agents trying to provoke incidents to make them look bad. Clearly the reporting is biased, too, since the protest is directed at the very wealthy- and who do you think owns the media?
More particularly, you mention "revile goodness"- I'm wondering what you are referring to. Aren't they reviling greed, considered a cardinal sin in most societies? Is that the "goodness" you refer to, or is it political corruption? Or does wealth equal goodness in your worldview? (Jesus said the wealthy were going to hell, for whatever it is worth- that it would be easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a wealthy man to get to heaven.)
Then you assume the protesters have failed to succeed (presumably equating success with material weaalth alone), and condemn them all with a broad brush to an early pauper's death. Just to illustrate your unexamined biases, I expect to join an OWS protest once the goals are clarified, and not only is my wife an MD, but I noticed my family owned company on a list of the largest landowners in Hawai'i, although we only have one ahupua'a and a few adjacent coastal sections of other ahupua'a. So for myself and no doubt others, I would say drowning while surfing off our land or getting hit on the head by a falling coconut from a poorly chosen oceanfront hammock site would be a far more likely early demise. Where do you expect to end your days? |
Edited by - ypochris on 11/20/2011 5:29:56 PM |
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Mike Anderson
Akahai
Canada
84 Posts |
Posted - 11/20/2011 : 6:12:55 PM
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Um...thought I'd made it clear I was talking specifically about the protesters in Vancouver, mate. Sorry you missed that.
Further: in Canada the mainstream media are almost entirely owned by wealthy leftists who have abetted the campers every way but materially. The problem of course, obviously I would think to anyone over toddler age, is that you deliberately took my comments completely out of context, and that moreover you have no idea what you're talking about since I was referring, as you well knew, to the Vancouver protest specifically.
Typical leftist evasion, redirection, and personal attack. You don't know me, so assumed I'd fall for that kind of low tactic. Now you know better. |
It's never too late to have a happy childhood! |
Edited by - Mike Anderson on 11/20/2011 6:57:23 PM |
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ypochris
Lokahi
USA
398 Posts |
Posted - 11/20/2011 : 7:08:23 PM
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I guess that would depend on how you define "contribute". On one level, I have dedicated much of my life to trying to better the lives of others. On another level, I've never felt handing someone some money was a very effctive way to improve the world, although when we run medical missions in third world countries like Honduras I have been known to give money to the elderly and cripples, and we have tried, with some succcess, microlending to help people start up businesses. We buy medical supplies, miles of pipe to provide clean water, build toilets, have repaired school buildings and an orphanage to make them usable, are trying to build a new orphanage, provide tons of food to the poor, transportation to hospitals when necessary, computers, are starting a school for orphans, pay tuition and bed and board for promising youth, etc.- but those are really just some obvious manifestations of a much deeper commitment. Closer to home I focus more on environmental and cultural issues- people are far better off here.
I think I can safely say most of my time and money is dedicated to helping others on some level. And that is how I see many, if not most, of the OWS protesters- trying to help others. People who are well enough off, but are worried about the destruction of democracy and their children's future in a world where greed seems to be the highest calling. People fighting for the future of virtually all of us, trying to make the country and world a better place without expecting some immediate reward, or even necessarily something that will help them personally. Essentially, a selfless movement.
Clearly others see them differently. But I can't help wondering how much that is just a result of unexamined biases, to use your words- or propaganda from the ultra-wealthy, to use mine. From a level of wealth I, in spite of my advantages, am nowhere even close to, and have no desire to attain.
P.S. Rather than a "pissing contest", I personally see interactions like these as an opportunity to contrast opposing views, hopefully resulting in edification of all parties. But I will admit to feeling a bit offended by my (apparently false) presumption that your comments were generally applicable to all OWS protest supporters. |
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Makana
Topic Locked
