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Kapila Kane
Ha`aha`a
USA
1051 Posts |
 Posted - 03/19/2012 : 08:04:17 AM
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Heard this from a picker and friend last week...
I complained that despite lots of background in music, string instruments and even guitar, and several years with lots of practice, that my progress (and confidence) in playing guitar finger style and especially Slack Key, was really slow, frustrating,
perhaps even dismal, considering I re-started guitar and entered Hawaiian Waters in 2002 --so surely I should be on Colorado's MOST-Talented List by now.
The picker said,
"It takes 10,000 hours, and THEN you can BEGIN to hit some good stuff" ...
but of course you'll then be in waters with the even Bigger and Better fish/pickers. And then you can start you're 2nd 10,000!
So I reckon' that's why violin/fiddle is more natural for me, AND STILL always a challenge... And there's always bigger player/sharks waiting to humble you in the next ocean!
ALSO, the things we start when we're young just get more deeply ingrained after years of "baby stepping" through the slow steady progress that kids can do slow and steady, and hit fewer psychological plateaus, where adults get frustrated after coming out of the chute like a bull.
Like learning a language, the 'mother-tongue' is easy when you're immersed from the cradle, and even hear it before birth.
Gotta go, I'm working on that 10,000 hours...with 10.000 more to go!
Let's enjoy the journey!
Hey, and if you're in Hawaii, or just Hawaiian music (ah, that's Transcendence) well, this is as good as it gets, gotta enjoy the journey.
Gotta go put in my shift.
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thumbstruck
Ahonui
USA
2168 Posts |
Posted - 03/19/2012 : 3:58:59 PM
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Slipry1's dictum: The more you do something, the better you get at it!
In learning any instrument, there is no wasted time. Time spent is familiarization and muscle memory. Remember to have fun! |
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Mika ele
Ha`aha`a
USA
1493 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2012 : 09:20:25 AM
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You can put in 10,000 hours sitting on the ground staring at a tree. That doesn't mean you will be able to make the tree grow any faster.
So, just playing for 10,000 hours may not result in what you expect. Effective practice annoys other people and SHOULD BE hard. My wife closes the door to my "music room" because I play the same short phrase over and over and over and over. And on songs I can play from beginning to end, most of the time, I only play the hard parts until I can play them without error and with greater ease.
I used to think I was putting some quality pratice time in on the guitar and ukulele but I wasn't really getting any better; just judging by the amount of time I invested. However, when I made a committment to play in public (open mic) regularly, I was initially embarrassed by the mistakes I made and the anxiety of performance because I arrived each time unprepared. Not wanting to recreate the public spectacle of a botched performance, I started to focus my practice time with specific goals; at first to play a single mele without mistakes. Then to play that same song with some emotion. Then to play that song well -- focusing on making each note contribute to the whole -- paying particular attention to individual note quality and tone and harmonic resonance. I wasn't just playing for me anymore, I was playing to have others enjoy the experience. There were lots of great contructive help from my performing friends -- not always what I wanted to hear, nontheless what I needed to hear.
Remember this:
There is only one human activity that simultaneously stimulates more areas of the brain than any other. The more we use that brain to it's fullest, the healthier and fitter it becomes. Play Slack Key for a Healthy Brain! :-D |
E nana, e ho'olohe. E pa'a ka waha, e hana ka lima. |
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thumbstruck
Ahonui
USA
2168 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2012 : 09:25:01 AM
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| Don't forget the importance of jamming. In an informal jam situation, we are relaxed and should be ready to take chances. We are also in a good position to learn by observation. It's also good to realize that our ears progress far faster than our hands. |
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Retro
Ahonui
USA
2368 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2012 : 10:42:16 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by thumbstruck
Don't forget the importance of jamming. In an informal jam situation, we are relaxed and should be ready to take chances. We are also in a good position to learn by observation. It's also good to realize that our ears progress far faster than our hands.
Agreed. My playing seems to improve best when I play regularly with others. For me, it's motivation to not screw up publicly, which makes the ensemble sound "less good." Practicing at home does not have the same effect - yet at home is where I focus on the unfamiliar and difficult chords or phrases. |
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GuitarVlog
Akahai
USA
60 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2012 : 12:15:35 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by thumbstruck
Slipry1's dictum: The more you do something, the better you get at it!
I'd modify that to say:
The more you do something correctly, the better you get at it!
If you practice mistakes, you will perform mistakes. Slow down and practice stuff right. Speed comes later (and it'll come faster than you think).
One other thing, focus on the passages that you do poorly and those 10,000 will be better spent. There's no point in buffing stuff that's already polished. A lot of players waste 90% of their limited practice time working on passages that they're already good at. |
- Keo |
Edited by - GuitarVlog on 03/27/2012 12:22:41 PM |
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slipry1
Ha`aha`a
USA
1511 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2012 : 6:01:44 PM
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| Time to chime in, since I've been quoted a couple of times here. My dad's mantra was "the more you do it, the better you'll get". Of course, you won't be very good at first, and you'll make a lot of maistakes, like you did when you learned to walk, slowly at first, with a lot of falls, and then faster. imho, experience is the culmination of many mistakes, none of them repeated (quote: "Man, I'll never try THAT again!"), hopefully. Even after 50 or so years of playing music, I still get lessons and advice from other musicians to help me get better. Don't be too proud to ask for help. |
keaka |
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slipry1
Ha`aha`a
USA
1511 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2012 : 6:05:11 PM
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| Oh, I forgot. In the Earl Scruggs bluegrass banjo book, he shows a roll with repeats at either end, and a "x1000" over it - meaning, "play this 1000 times". When I need to get my banjo chops up, I get the book and a metronome and go at it. slowly at first, and then faster. |
keaka |
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Trev
Lokahi
United Kingdom
265 Posts |
Posted - 03/28/2012 : 03:13:18 AM
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I’ve heard the ‘ten thousand hours’ thing before. t’s an interesting theory, but I don’t think it’s an exact science. Some people pick up things more quickly than others. Some people just appear to have an extra something wired up that makes them better.
I understand how tempting it is to think that anyone can be a ‘genius’ if you only put the hours in, but I think there’s more to it than that. While it’s true that everyone I’ve ever met who was good had put a lot of time in practising, there’s something else that people seem to have got or not. Creativity, expression, the place where the personality and the magic seem to happen.
But it’s not important. You don’t have to be ‘the best player in Colorado’ to enjoy it – any more than you need to be as good as Tiger Woods to enjoy playing golf.
Only one person in Colorado is going to be the best, and the odds are it’ll be someone else. It doesn’t matter. Jeebus, I’m never even the best player in the pub, never mind in the county!
What matters is – can I play some tunes that I like? Are there tunes I like that I can’t play? If so, learn those ones. It might take ages – I might never get to finish it- but it's lot of fun and pleasure giving it a go.
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Mika ele
Ha`aha`a
USA
1493 Posts |
Posted - 03/31/2012 : 1:13:16 PM
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Actually there have been studies that support the 10,000 hours hypothesis. This book is an exceptionally good read (after the first chapter). His studies have shown that no other human activity simultaneously stimulates more areas of the brain than playing a musical instrument and singing/dancing.
"Your Brain on Music: The Science of Human Obsession" by Dr. Daniel J. Levitin ISBN-10: 0525949690 ISBN-13: 978-0525949695 http://daniellevitin.com/publicpage/books/this-is-your-brain-on-music/
As a Cognitive Scientist, he studies this stuff alot! 
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Ultimately, contrary to the notion of musical ‘gift’, Levitin argues that, even for the likes of the young Mozart, genetic propensity only gets you about halfway; the rest is environment and hard work.
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. . . . says the average person has more musical ability than is often believed: even the minimally-trained ear expects the 7th to resolve to the 8ve, and can immediately distinguish between Dylan acoustic and Dylan electric. Most people are at least expert listeners of music, and they should be: Americans spend more money on music than on prescription drugs.
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E nana, e ho'olohe. E pa'a ka waha, e hana ka lima. |
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Kapila Kane
Ha`aha`a
USA
1051 Posts |
Posted - 03/31/2012 : 1:50:12 PM
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or as I always tell the 4th grade beginners...
Teacher: "Practice makes (arm gesture)(what)?
they answer" "Perfect!"
"Well, that's what I THOUGHT TOO!--BUT
THE TRUTH IS: Practice makes permanent--so you better practice it right".
So,not only the tune and licks, but the way you hold guitar, put fingers down, etc...Everything can become ingrained. But are we going on tour, or is this for fun?
Also, 10,000 hours is way conservative.
I asked a fried who recorded for 25 years with Jackson Browne...
and when I asked him, "hey Doug, how many hours did it take to get those album cuts with Jackson?"
Answer: "A million"
Little me: "no really, how many?"
Answer: A million!
And this answer NEVER changed, even if I asked him a million times! |
Edited by - Kapila Kane on 03/31/2012 1:52:28 PM |
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thumbstruck
Ahonui
USA
2168 Posts |
Posted - 03/31/2012 : 3:54:15 PM
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| Music has been proven to be a "drug". It can raise and lower blood pressure (thus slack key is Dr's orders for me), alter conscious state, affect emotions, improve digestion, etc. Does that mean we all have to wear white coats when we play? |
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TerryLiberty
Lokahi
USA
207 Posts |
Posted - 03/31/2012 : 4:35:42 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Mika ele
Actually there have been studies that support the 10,000 hours hypothesis...
Some other good reading on the subject can be found in the book "The Talent Code" by Daniel Coyle, "Blink" and "Outliers" by Malcom Gladwell and much of the original work done by K. Anders Ericcson.
Much of what I see there is also that the practice needs to be very deliberate and highly focused. It should involve setting goals, working toward them and fixing problems along the way.
Gotta go and practice...
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Terry
Olympia, WA
Forever a haumana |
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The 10,000 hours theory...
