| Author |
 Topic  |
|
Admin
Pupule
USA
4551 Posts |
 Posted - 06/17/2011 : 03:38:31 AM
|
Aloha everyone,
This morning, I removed the post "2011 Grammy Awards..." pending a review of the situation. I do not like removing posts from the forum which is why it is so infrequently done. I especially appreciated the discussion since there were good points made by a diverse group representing different views.
However, it was brought to my attention that some of the discussion in the thread may have legal implications. Due to the uncertainty of that and given that Taropatch.net is a public forum, I believe it is in the best interest of this website to remove the thread until there is better clarity on the issues.
I also believe the thread has deteriorated to the point where it is now going against the mission of Taropatch:quote:
OUR MISSION is to: - Show appreciation for Hawaiian music and for those who make it.
- List and review resources for learning ki ho`alu.
- Provide a community where we can share music, song, and aloha in cyberspace.
With these simple goals in mind, we will do our best to show respect to the Hawaiian islands, its people and cultures, its music and musicians. As a "live" community, you ultimately decide what this place is all about.
|
Andy |
|
|
wcerto
Ahonui
USA
5052 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2011 : 06:24:04 AM
|
| I understand your concern about the legal issues but I do not think the post should have been removed. |
Me ke aloha
Malama pono,
Wanda |
 |
|
|
chunky monkey
Ha`aha`a
USA
1025 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2011 : 07:50:26 AM
|
| Wanda, you're not the one who would have been sued. I agree with Andy. |
|
|
|
Mika ele
Ha`aha`a
USA
1493 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2011 : 08:34:02 AM
|
Andy,
The discussion, while initially interesting, had become volatile and deragatory, bordering on defamation. It was, however, enlightening. Some heated discussions, although passionate, are ion hindsight -- regrettable. I support your action Andy. |
E nana, e ho'olohe. E pa'a ka waha, e hana ka lima. |
|
|
|
Retro
Ahonui
USA
2368 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2011 : 09:23:05 AM
|
I believe someone said that Keola Beamer's thoughts were available on his Facebook page, if someone wishes to read them again. (I'm not on Facebook, so I can't confirm that.)
As for other postings in the thread, I think Andy was wise to remove them, to avoid the potential of legal action. |
|
|
|
Peter Medeiros
`Olu`olu
546 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2011 : 10:10:05 AM
|
I concur with Andy. It was necessary. Maybe it is a reflection of the times, but I noticed that TP was becoming less hospitable, and that TP seemed to be on a downward trend because this topic and a number of other recent topics had degenerated into pissing matches. The mission statement and goals are clear and simple.
As Mike said, over the past several months we have moved away from the kind of topics that are positive, insightful and helpful. I think we need to be reminded that you should always try and take the high road, that it is better to be civil to one another rather than at each other’s throats. Legal action, as an alternative, is very expensive, and should be avoided at all costs.
|
|
|
|
markwitz
`Olu`olu
USA
841 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2011 : 10:18:18 AM
|
quote:
Originally posted by Retro
I believe someone said that Keola Beamer's thoughts were available on his Facebook page, if someone wishes to read them again. (I'm not on Facebook, so I can't confirm that.)
As for other postings in the thread, I think Andy was wise to remove them, to avoid the potential of legal action.
This is the post from Keola Beamer's facebook page from Wednesday 6/15 that Gregg is referring to.
Quoted in it's entirety.
"
A philosophy born of the Hawaiian Slack Key Guitar guides us to the simple idea that good music doesn't come from the ego, it comes from the heart. To play with aloha in our hearts, we must learn to make the way of aloha an integral, "living" part of our own existence.
Perhaps the first step is to understand what we Hawaiians have named - ha'aha'a. This is the concept of humility. Get away from the city and look up at the firmament on some dark and starry night. Do you feel the wonder in your heart? What an incredible Universe this truly is. So vast. So unknowable. When we realize that there are forces much greater than ourselves all around us, we begin to grasp the simple concept of ha'aha'a.
Somehow, as human beings - we bring with us a complex story. This is the story of who we are, how we got to be the way we are, where we went to school, what kind of cars we drive, who we married and what we do for a living. Our history becomes the elaborate and confining cornerstones of our lives. The wall of the ego grows larger with each re-telling, "Hey - I did this! I did that!" Our story gets louder and louder. Me. Me.
Isn't this a lot to carry around in our lives? Its kind of like going to the train station with the same huge load of luggage, year after year. Some of us are so obsessed with our own story, that we have little room for anything else in our lives. We begin to feel an emptiness that we can't define.
To practice ha'aha'a, try turning down the volume of your story.
Tomorrow morning at the very first moment you wake up, don't rush to make the coffee, don't bolt out of bed. Stay quiet for awhile. Try to still the surface waters of your mind. Now fill your senses with the word "Mahalo" (thank you). What a beautiful word that is, Mahalo. Form the word with your lips and speak it softly to yourself. Say it again in the privacy of your heart. Say it out loud. Feel it on your breath as it flows out into the world.
Feels kind of nice, doesn't it? Kind of a pleasant way to start the day? In your heart you begin to discover an unaccustomed humility. It is the beginning of a new dawn and you chant the Universe.
Keola Beamer
Maui, Hawaii" |
"The music of the Hawaiians, the most fascinating in the world, is still in my ears and
haunts me sleeping and waking."
Mark Twain |
|
|
|
Retro
Ahonui
USA
2368 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2011 : 10:29:33 AM
|
| Wisdom comes in a multitude of flavors, but anger makes everything taste bitter. |
|
|
|
Mark E
Lokahi
USA
186 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2011 : 2:46:55 PM
|
| Norman - Thanks for posting Keola's statement. I was sorry to see it go. |
|
|
|
ypochris
Lokahi
USA
398 Posts |
Posted - 06/18/2011 : 10:02:12 AM
|
Andy,
Censorship through threat of legal action? It wouldn't be the first time. Me, I'd just out and say "so-and-so threatened to sue me if I didn't remove this thread". And being me, I'd leave it up.
Perhaps that is not how it went down. But if it was, realize that posters on many sites delve deeply into controversial topics, and while individuals have been sued for libel for what they have said, as far as I know no public forums have ever been held responsible for what a poster on that forum has said- after all, what we write here is beyond your control.
I do appreciate the generally hospitable, friendly interactions here on the lo'i, and am in favor of not permitting divisiveness that would lead to people leaving the site. I must say, however, that I found this topic interesting and informative. If you removed the thread primarily because you felt it was not adhering to the site policies or the spirit of aloha, that is entirely understandable. I just hate this feeling I have that you were threatened into taking it down.
|
|
|
|
Retro
Ahonui
USA
2368 Posts |
Posted - 06/18/2011 : 1:35:28 PM
|
quote:
Originally posted by Admin
However, it was brought to my attention that some of the discussion in the thread may have legal implications. Due to the uncertainty of that and given that Taropatch.net is a public forum, I believe it is in the best interest of this website to remove the thread until there is better clarity on the issues.
People seem to be extrapolating from this comment that there has been a "threat" of legal action; maybe there has, maybe there hasn't - but Andy did not say that there was.
Maybe he just decided to be cautious - not a bad trait in a forum owner/moderator. Note he also said "...pending a review of the situation." When there's more for us to know, I trust he'll be back to tell us. |
|
|
|
Mike Anderson
Akahai
Canada
84 Posts |
Posted - 06/19/2011 : 07:18:34 AM
|
Today is Father's Day and because I am fortunate enough to have been blessed with a beautiful and healthy, loving 8-year old son, I was able to feel that mahalo and that ha'aha'a as soon as I woke up. Mahalo to markwitz too, for posting that quote from Keola Beamer - no wonder the man is able to play as he does.
Happy Father's day to all the Dads here and mahalo for this great forum. |
It's never too late to have a happy childhood! |
Edited by - Mike Anderson on 06/19/2011 08:21:05 AM |
|
|
|
slipry1
Ha`aha`a
USA
1511 Posts |
Posted - 06/19/2011 : 09:54:17 AM
|
| Mahalo to Norm for posting Keola's remarks. Another way of saying what I have posted about the Grammy's being of, by and for the "suits", is that Grammys are about egos, not about music. As for what goes on there "No boddah me". And maybe that's the source of all the vitriol - we were exercising our egos, not dealing with the ha'aha'a. |
keaka |
|
|
|
Retro
Ahonui
USA
2368 Posts |
Posted - 06/19/2011 : 10:06:52 AM
|
quote:
Originally posted by slipry1
And maybe that's the source of all the vitriol - we were exercising our egos, not dealing with the ha'aha'a.
Sometimes, my dear Uncle Keaka, you have amazing clarity.
We should all read carefully anything we intend to post before we do so - with an extra timeout for additional review of any post containing the word "Grammy." |
|
|
|
Puna
Lokahi
USA
227 Posts |
Posted - 06/20/2011 : 06:08:15 AM
|
quote:
Originally posted by Retro
- with an extra timeout for additional review of any post containing the word "Grammy."
I used to go to my Grammy's on Thanksgiving.
Yes Gregg, I thought about this carefully before posting  |
Puna |
|
|
|
Retro
Ahonui
USA
2368 Posts |
Posted - 06/20/2011 : 06:43:06 AM
|
quote:
Originally posted by Puna
quote:
Originally posted by Retro
- with an extra timeout for additional review of any post containing the word "Grammy."
I used to go to my Grammy's on Thanksgiving.
Yes Gregg, I thought about this carefully before posting
Yeah, but did you go for the art of Thanksgiving itself - or was it all about the food for you?
(And yes, there is definitely an art to giving thanks...) |
Edited by - Retro on 06/20/2011 06:43:24 AM |
|
|
|
Topic |
|
2011 Grammy Awards... [removed]
