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poipicker
Aloha
8 Posts |
 Posted - 04/30/2005 : 6:12:54 PM
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Aloha,
I'm looking for sources of slack key tableture, especially instrumental Beamer, or the Slack Key Guitar volumes 1 and 2. It's a lot easier with the tabs...
Thanks in advance.
Poipicker
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Keone
Akahai
50 Posts |
Posted - 05/03/2005 : 12:16:38 PM
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Aloha 'picker,
There really some great resources for Keola Beamer slack. All of his books have songs from his albums, in addition his DVD for slack key is a great resource, and finally his website has online lessons with great songs. If you check out the Learn area of taropatch you'll get more information. For the Slack Key Guitar Volumes 1 and 2 (I presume you mean the Palm records one), I'm not so sure which songs are on there. I know from Vol 2, Sonny Lim does a version of Punahele...this is available at www.stropes.com as is Sonny Chillingworth Dream Slack key. If you're talking about Dancing Cats Masters of Slack Vol 1, then check out Mark Hanson's book on Masters of Slack Key guitar. Good luck. Hope this helps, and check out the Learning section. |
Keone |
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alasdair
Aloha
Germany
22 Posts |
Posted - 05/06/2005 : 3:16:54 PM
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Poipicker,
you're best best is grabbing the "amazing slow downer" off the internet and working the tunes out by ear although it's not an easy task if you're a beginner or tone deaf. :)
As you can see by the # of posts i'm relatively new here but by perusing past threads you can see that Ki Ho`alu pickers would appear to be very touchy on the topic of tabs. I play a lot of bluegrass and fiddly celtic ditties of which there must be thousands, if not tens of thousands of tabs being passed around / written and shared on the net ,slack key folks though seem to have a "this is my arrangement and i'm not telling you, so buy this book instead" outlook. Of course when you meet them one-on-one, (my experience with led kaapana after a gig) he's more than happy to talk music with guitar in hand. Alas, for some hawaii is further away than a hop,skip & wobble. It's wierd.
alasdair
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RJS
Ha`aha`a
1635 Posts |
Posted - 05/06/2005 : 7:36:55 PM
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I can only speak for myself- It's not so much an issue of "touchiness," so here's my thinking on the subject:
I don't share my arrangements of other people's songs because I respect their ownership of their music. I also don't share other people's tabs for the same reason. The only exceptions are those TABS for which I have permission to share, my arrangements of public domain songs, (and perhaps a tab or two among close friends.)
I can also tell you why I do this --- over the course of decades the Hawaiian people were ripped off to an incredible degree. (Please, I don't want to get into a discussion of victimization, participating in the proess, etc.) Respecting authors' rights is, for me, both part respect as well as trying to keep a non-exploitative approach to my relations with Hawaiian friends and teachers.
As for my own original compositions -- when I write something, it feels very personal. And I am very much an introverted person. I don't give that stuff away -- Sometimes, after a song I wrote has been "out there" for enough time, it seems to loose the strength of its personal connection. These songs I am more willing to share. However, I never share a TAB without a recorded version of the TAB. Frankly, it's a big pain for me to record something, so I have to be really motivated.
As to charging for my work. Yes, I do. I used to give it away. Took time and energy, not to mention a few dollars to do that. On follow up I found out that frequently people did not use the materials I sent. Therefore, I now charge. That way I feel the person to whom I send so,mething is more likely to use it.
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Auntie Nancy
`Olu`olu
USA
593 Posts |
Posted - 05/07/2005 : 12:44:47 PM
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aloha poipicker (how do you Pick Poi?)
Check C-Patch's list of available published sources for tabs. That would be a very good start.
n |
nancy cook |
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Kiwini
Lokahi
USA
203 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2005 : 11:41:23 AM
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Call me confused or whatever, but if we all look back at the history of slack key and how the secrecy of the tunings and stylings almost drove it to near extinction, why does the dichotomy still exist today? A wise man once said, "Those who fail to study history are condemned to repeat it"
I hope I can speak for Poipicker and others as I do for myself that when we ask for tabs, please don't assume we are asking for free music so that we can exploit it. Please don't assume that we don't respect the right for reputable artists to make a living off what they do professionally. Think instead that maybe we are simply asking help in the "process" of attaining music tabs to help us study, learn and promote the beautiful sound of Kiho'alu, in hopes that those who have toiled their whole lives at the art can continue to reap more of what they sow. Not in illegal material but in copywrited material legally for sale.
My thinking on the subject is this...We could never out-perform or out-draw the masters of kiho'alu at their most profitable venus, the CD's,the concerts, and their workshops. What we can do is learn to be an ambassador, or a promoter for the art to help them make a better living, freeing up their time to help us become better ambassadors and promoters so that they can make a mo bettah livin and............nuff said.
Ua mau ke e o ka aina, i ka pono.
Mahalo for those of you who have given us kokua online and off,
Kiwini |
Edited by - Kiwini on 05/11/2005 1:27:21 PM |
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MahinaM
Lokahi
USA
389 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2005 : 11:53:57 AM
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Well said, Kiwini!
M |
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thumbstruck
Ahonui
USA
2168 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2005 : 3:30:49 PM
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| Da guy dat wen teach me wen tell me, "Any kine, 'long as it fit." Led told me he rarely plays the same thing twice. Jus' press, sometimes da surprizes good! |
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RJS
Ha`aha`a
1635 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2005 : 4:09:08 PM
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Kiwini,
Please forgive me if I am missing something, but I don’t get the anger.
There are over 75 songs in slack key arrangements available in commercial TAB, probably more than 100.
(All the following have TAB and a recording, some also include standard notation:)
Off the top of my head all of these are still available:
Ozzie’s Book,
Ron Loo’s tapes
Led. K tape,
Keola: Tape, 2 Books, Website
Mark H – Book
Dan Ho – Book
DVD’s by: Patrick L, George K, Keoki K, John K
I have 2 tapes available,
(Kiwini, on top of that, in the past year Led K has done 2 workshops in Palo Alto, Keola has offered at least 1 in Los Gatos, pretty short drives from Gilroy.)
There has never been as much material available, and at very reasonable costs.
If you got half of the stuff above and really learned it you would be a dynamite slack key player.
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Auntie Nancy
`Olu`olu
USA
593 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2005 : 6:09:30 PM
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Aloha Ray,
We just don't all share your opinion or approach. You need not share any of your tabs. That's fine! We all respect that. I don't necessarily want to learn all those songs that you know are published and printed before learning ones I like. Right now there are several HAPA tunes, more Keali'i Reichel tunes, and three special tunes of 'Ikaika Brown's that I would like to learn. If someone's tabbed them and the rights to the songs/arrangements are available for share, what's wrong with sharing. And there are several of us who frankly are living on a very low cash flow and simply can't afford to buy each of those books, CDs or DVDs just for the one or two songs we'd like to have halp learning. Please respect our pursuits as you would have us respect yours.
auntie nancy |
nancy cook |
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hapakid
Luna Ho`omalu
USA
1533 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2005 : 9:27:21 PM
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Hoho! The TAB topic comes round again! Auwe!
The number one reason we don't openly share TAB here is to respect the rights of artists and arrangers. But the second reason is to keep Andy (Admin) out of trouble with lawyers.
And the third reason is that a lot of us don't learn via TAB, so we don't have a lot of it. It's not secrecy, we're just lazy about tabbing stuff out.
To keep this stuff from being rehashed and bitterness spreading, just talk with people you know who play and share one-on-one. If you don't know any other slackers, email someone on this board. If they don't have TAB, they might tell you where to find it or teach you over the phone. Almost everybody will bend over backwards to help another player.
Slack key is a small enough world that there have been hard feelings from casual mass sharing. We've heard about it here on this board. Virtually none of us would exploit a musicians work (because we play badly and just for fun), but it happens and here we try to head it off before it becomes a problem.
Raymond is a bonafide arranger and performer, so he sees it differently than most of us three chord hackers. Like Ray said, there's a ton of TABs out there and CPatch's list tells you where to find them. Also, DVDs like "Ki Ho'alu (Loosen the Key)" and John Keawe's new film give you a chance to see the artist playing the song. Much easier than TAB!
Jesse Tinsley
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Kiwini
Lokahi
USA
203 Posts |
Posted - 05/10/2005 : 01:00:19 AM
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Poipicker, please forgive me for having used your name in assuming that you held the same view as myself. Whether you do agree or not, I apologize.
Aloha, Kiwini
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alasdair
Aloha
Germany
22 Posts |
Posted - 05/10/2005 : 02:14:01 AM
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kiwini you've eloquently elaborated on my sentiments exactly.
Here in this part of europe, i'm the only person i've ever
met (if one can indeed meet oneself) who can play, let alone
recognize slackkey when heard. It's only a part of my
repertoire but i throw in a few tunes here and there and at the
end of the night a few more folks have been "enlightened", "enchanted"
or whatever you might call it, at the very least they can
associate the waves they percieve as being slackkey and of hawaiian origin.
More people playing slackkey will enable more people to hear it which is what music is ultimately about which is why i find the "you have to pay to get in" attitude so wierd. I've only encounted such an attitude here and from my own expierence i'd deem it as being about as
un-hawaiian as you can get.
@ Ray: no-one is angry and no, we are not after your arrangements 
"But the second reason is to keep Andy (Admin) out of trouble with lawyers." I can understand that.
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Reid
Ha`aha`a
Andorra
1526 Posts |
Posted - 05/10/2005 : 05:00:20 AM
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As Jesse said: " Hoho! The TAB topic comes round again! Auwe!"
Frankly, I am kicking my `okole for getting into this, because it has been done to death, and *all* the reasons for it have been stated so many times (and are in the archives). And it is *always* contentious and spoils everybody's day.
Let me repeat just two reasons (and it is like picking at a scab).
Unlike Alasdair's "bluegrass and fiddly celtic ditties of which there must be thousands", there are only a relatively small number of Slack Key tabs created by only a small number of artists in Hawai`i AND many of us know them and they are our friends. They make part of their living selling them (or licensing them to be sold) and their living is NOT easy. It is difficult, to understand how they survive at all. When you copy and distribute their tabs, you are taking food out of the mouths of our friends. Please don't tell me you can't spend $22.95 for Ozzie's Mel Bay tab book (for instance), because I just know you spent more than that on 2 movies or 2 weeks of cell phone subscription, or whatever.
Second, once before, Ozzie Kotani freely distributed his tabs. All he asked for was a little respect and that his name remain on the tabs. Some guy in the Islands took his tabs, obscured Oz's name with white-out and published these tabs as his own and used them in workshops and whatnot. Cockaroach. So, Oz took legal action, which he *hated* to do, but Oz makes part of his living publishing these tabs and basing workshops on them (the tabs are given to the attendees). Now, Oz is one of the kindest, most accessible, generous people I know, and he has given us many of his tabs when he felt they would answer a need of ours. But, he has stopped doing this as a general thing, because the only thing Oz has as an artist (much like a publishing scientist) is his reputation and his reputation was stolen. There is more than one cockaroach out there, just waiting.
I hereby promise myself never, ever to get into this swamp again.
...Reid
...Reid |
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Auntie Nancy
`Olu`olu
USA
593 Posts |
Posted - 05/10/2005 : 05:19:22 AM
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Well Reid, you don't have to agree. And the fact is, I don't own a cell phone and don't go to movies. The way I lucked out to get to go to Camp is that I take in roommates. I can afford to buy a couple books and I have, I can afford to go to a couple workshops here and there and I have. that's at the expense of doing any diving this year. Unbelievable as it may seem, there are some non-musicians who enjoy and would like to learn, and although the demographic of this site is white male retired or close to it, there are others. If you have 6 kids and one stays out late, are you going to ground all 6? Well, that's not the way I look at the world. And I didn't know you had cockroaches back there.
For those of you who are interested and would like to share tabs, please e-mail me direstly and we'll try to set up a network on the side and share. We'll do it honestly and honorably. That's the way I live my life - I don't share nor understand the other side and don't want to.
auntie nancy |
nancy cook |
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`Ilio Nui
`Olu`olu
USA
826 Posts |
Posted - 05/10/2005 : 05:24:47 AM
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quote:
I hereby promise myself never, ever to get into this swamp again.
...Reid
Please don't promise that. It's the voice of reason that occasionally needs to be repeated to people who can't use the "Search" function for this forum.
Mahalo,
Dave |
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