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wcerto
Ahonui
USA
5052 Posts |
 Posted - 03/07/2007 : 07:58:03 AM
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You may be interested in reading this article from Hawai`i Magazine. After you have read it, I would be interested in any comments you may have about it.
http://www.hawaiimagazine.com/magazine/24/2/douglas_kahikina_chang
I have often thought about what hurt or damage we may be doing by visiting Hawai`i. II am excited to see this article, though. Especially the column off to the right side which talks about things that need to be done to enhance the tourist experience, especially the part about returning traditional Hawaiian music to the hotels, lounges, etc.
I really like that Mr. Chang advocates using local products in his hotel. Seems to me that agriculture could be the salvation of Hawai`i, as long as it is done properly anad carefully. I have often wondered by Hawaiian beef goes to Canada or Austrailian instead of being used in Hawai`i. I have often wondered why milk is so expensive in Hawai`i, when some of those beef cattle could be dairy cattle. I have wondered why some hotels have the same hard, tasteless tomatoes that we have to put up with here in Ohio for most of the year.
When we were on our cruise last year, we were so disappointed that the cruise line did not have any fresh, local fruits; or why the coffee tasted like burnt Starbucks junk, instead of wonderful Kona, Maui or Kaua`i coffee. We were also disappointed that even though the ship had a "Hawaiian Cultural Center" instead of a casino, and great artifacts in a museum like setting, they still taught hula to "My little Grass Shack". No one told the history like Wayne Chang did on our first Hawaiian cruise. There was no traditional Hawaiian music on the ship. Muzak played Iz frequently, but no ki ho`alu.
I don't get it. Seems to me if tourists wanted ersatz culture, they could stay home and order it off the internet.
Please share your comments with us.
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Me ke aloha
Malama pono,
Wanda |
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cpatch
Ahonui
USA
2187 Posts |
Posted - 03/07/2007 : 08:24:01 AM
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| Sadly, most tourists (Americans especially) want a hermetically sealed cultural environment that they can gaze out of in order to catch glimpses of a Disney version of the world outside. |
Craig
My goal is to be able to play as well as people think I can. |
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Reid
Ha`aha`a
Andorra
1526 Posts |
Posted - 03/07/2007 : 10:57:32 AM
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Craig is so right, Wanda. They don't want to know about reality.
About the veggies and pipi: the land is much too valuable for agriculture; its "development" value is too high. So, multimillion $$ houses and condo complexes get built instead. There are still some farms (for flowers, too) around Kula in Maui and other places, but you only see the produce occasionally at "farmer's markets". Last time we were there, cattle were very scarce at Ulupalakua - mostly classy horses, and not many of those either. Even Parker Ranch has a sign at the top of the hill that says it is a real estate development company.
...Reid |
Edited by - Reid on 03/07/2007 11:45:42 AM |
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Admin
Pupule
USA
4551 Posts |
Posted - 03/07/2007 : 11:06:51 AM
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| It's an encouraging article. If our community is any indication, there is a very real market for authentic tourism. |
Andy |
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Mark
Ha`aha`a
USA
1628 Posts |
Posted - 03/07/2007 : 2:47:41 PM
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This is an important issue for all of us.
Many folks here have visited Hawaii regularly for many, many years. And I'd hazard a guess that it is only after getting involved in the music, dance, language etc that folks start to "get it." In other words, see Hawaii for what it is, and not just another beach, golf course, spa, whatever.
The idea of sustainable cultural tourism is starting to take root in Hawaii. It's what the Aloha Camp is all about. It's what George's camp is all about. It's what the Hotel Hana Maui is doing, and the Lodge and Beach Village at Molokai Ranch, and a handful of smaller places scattered around the islands. Sadly, the list kinda runs out there, doesn't it?
So what? The good news is people on this forum are at the beginning of something new. Taropatchers go to Hawaii to be part of Hawaii.
So when you go to Hawaii to hang out with the slack key players -- make a point of telling everyone you meet on the Island what you are doing.
Write a letter about your trip to the local tourism office -- better yet, stop in and say "hi." Tell them why you came, and why you'll come back.
Buy your pupu and beverages from a local store instead of a chain-- and tell the people at the store and restaurants where you are staying and what you are doing and why.
If you subscribe to a magazine like Islands or Hawaii or Conde Nast Traveler, write letters to the editor about your experiences. You'd be surprised how much they count.
Buy local food -- shop the farmers markets, find the restaurants that support local growers, drink local coffee and beer. (Sorry, I draw the line at Hawaiian wine...  )
Next time you book your trip, stay somewhere that respects Hawaiian cultural values, even if it costs a few bucks more. You can ask the HVCB to suggest one. Or check out Alternative Hawaii (http://www.alternative-hawaii.com/) a website for eco and cultural tourism. (I have no relationship with this site, BTW)
If you haven't done so yet, come to one of the cultural/music retreats like George's or Keoki's or Led's or the Aloha Music Camp. It is more important than you think.
Here's the deal -- twice each year, the Aloha Camp brings between 60 and 100 people to Moloka`i to have a cultural experience. You don't think that makes a difference to the local economy??? Think about it -- when you come to one of the camps, you buy air tix, ground transportation, hotels, meals, taxis, tips, t-shirts, postcards, CDs, pupu.... and it is all because you want to learn to play guitar or ukulele or learn the hula.
I've been working with the MVB and HCVB for a couple of years to get them to see the camps as an important economic force. So far we are talking pretty small numbers - maybe 250-300 people each year, max. But that can add up when you figure in what economists call the mulitplier effect. Not to mention that George celebrates his 10 anniversary this year, and it'll be the 9th Aloha Camp in June. So we're talking several million dollars for non-traditional tourism. Chump change? Maybe. But a start.
Nonetheless, I'll tell you that every one of the camps is on precarious ground. We all need to survive and to grow, and it's kinda up to you.
What we really need are many more activities like these camps -- two day immersions, hands-on classes at the hotels, fish pond rebuilding workshops, cultural walks, talk stories, real hula classes, you name it... in short, activities that are fun, constructive and, above all, rooted in Hawaii. If you ask for them, they will happen.
One more thing: Forget about cruises, OK? Unless you are going to be paddling or setting sail. There isn't really much about a cruise ship that is good for Hawaii -- the boats pollute, most of your money stays in some far off place instead of being spent locally, the crews aren't local, the hordes of tourists going ashore clog the infrastructure, the harbors take a beating... and please don't ask me what happens when you flush the head… |
Edited by - Mark on 03/07/2007 3:00:08 PM |
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Retro
Ahonui
USA
2368 Posts |
Posted - 03/08/2007 : 09:23:08 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Mark
Many folks here have visited Hawaii regularly for many, many years. And I'd hazard a guess that it is only after getting involved in the music, dance, language etc that folks start to "get it."
I'd make the same assumption, Mark - very well said. |
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JeffC
Lokahi
USA
189 Posts |
Posted - 03/08/2007 : 10:57:11 AM
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Here, here, Mark! To steal and mutilate a U2 lyric, I do belive that cultural awareness and appreciation ("rock and roll") can really change the world. And not keeping ourselves separated from local people, activities, places, food, etc., can highten the enjoyment and appreciation. And that works both ways.
And come, on Mark, I've had a really interesting Hawaiian wine!
Jeff (Napa Valley native and former professional wine snob  ) |
Jeff
Making Trout Country safe for Slack Key! |
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Larry Goldstein
Lokahi
267 Posts |
Posted - 03/08/2007 : 10:59:45 AM
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Thank you Mark for your optimism and encouragement. Great post!
At the risk of being too political, but hopefully in the same spirit, may I also suggest folks write a letter demanding a full environmental impact statement before the Superferry is allowed to become a reality.
Concerns over the ferry are many, and they extend beyond just adverse effects to already damaged harbor ecosystems. For example, increased introduction of invasive species. The ferry will serve the military as well, and has been designed to accomodate one Stryker Brigade.
A good place to start is Sen. J. Kalani English, Chair of the Senate Transportation and International Affairs Committee. You can reach him at www.kalanienglish.com
Larry |
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alika207
Ha`aha`a
USA
1260 Posts |
Posted - 04/08/2007 : 02:53:19 AM
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Aue! Maika'i no! Loved reading it and completely agree. I have told lots of people here on the mainland that, for example, hapa haole music is not the same as traditional Hawaiian music. I have gone on to say that it is music that is in the 'olelo and referred to such talents as Keali'i Reichel, Israel Kamakawiwo'ole, and others. The good news is I have gotten some people hooked on some of those artists now.
Also, I don't know how many of you have seen posts about these, but hawaiianmusiclover06 and I teach 'olelo Hawai'i lessons i ke kelepona. We've had people from all over the U.S. come on our calls and welcome more and more interested folks to attend future ones. They aren't very in-depth lessons, just ways to get non-speakers acquainted with basic words, phrases, and even mele. We both feel that this is a good thing for us to do; we love promoting the culture, 'olelo, and music of Hawai'i Nei so much. Be looking out for audio clips of our last lesson soon. I will post them when they're available. |
He kehau ho'oma'ema'e ke aloha.
'Alika / Polinahe |
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wcerto
Ahonui
USA
5052 Posts |
Posted - 04/08/2007 : 04:52:25 AM
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| As Mark said above, that cruises are no good for Hawai'i...I'm not sure about that. As far as environmental impact, I am not certain. The Norwegian Cruise Line ships are of US registry. This means that they do not have to call at a foreign port before turning back to Hawai'i. This means that they must use US citizens to staff the ship. This also provides an economically feasible way for people to visit different Hawaiian islands in a more cost effective way. Yes, NCL can do much more to honor the ocean and land they are permitted to sail. They can do much, much more in regards to promoting culture and music of Hawai`i. Of course, they provide what their customers want or are willing to pay for. Each day people come from the cruise ships to go onto the `aina, to sho, to eat, to take various tours. Lots of people make a living from that. What it did for Paul and I was to permit us to 1) realize that visiting Hawai`i is within the economic possibility for someone who is not rich 2)provide a glimpse into the personality of each island we visited, thereby giving ideas for coming back and staying on land 3)exposure to real Hawaiian folks, to talk story, ti listen to, to understand. They are not all bad...they do use a lot of oil and other resources, but if passengers/customers of the cruise lines fill out those surveys at the end of the cruise, or corresponde directly with the cruise lines in telling them what you want to see or not see, then perhaps there can be a change. |
Me ke aloha
Malama pono,
Wanda |
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RWD
`Olu`olu
USA
850 Posts |
Posted - 04/08/2007 : 06:05:40 AM
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Great article Wanda.
Good response Mark.
A while back I asked why the Hawaiian legislators didn't regulate things detrimental to Hawaii and asked why visitors should have to worry about choosing commercial enterprises that were not desecrating the environment. I am so happy to see that this seems to be happening--maybe not directly with legislation (yet), but in another equally effective and logical way. Visitors should be concerned about thier impact while off on thier own.
This post has also given me a renewed feeling of good faith. I guess it's not the issues that bring on the occational rifts, but it is more likely the temperment and aloha within the responders.
Bob
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Bob |
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Mark
Ha`aha`a
USA
1628 Posts |
Posted - 04/08/2007 : 2:13:20 PM
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quote:
As Mark said above, that cruises are no good for Hawai'i...I'm not sure about that. As far as environmental impact, I am not certain.
A quick Google search on "environmental impact of criuse ships" netted 1.3 million hits.
Here's a quote from Kahea, the Hawaiian Environmental Alliance http://www.kahea.org/ocean/
quote:
Cruise ship traffic in Hawaiian waters is expanding at a rapid rate. Alarmingly, cruise ships are being allowed to operate without regulations necessary to protect our oceans.
Incredibly, the most common practice of cruise ships is to dump waste at sea, usually at night. While they are not supposed to release raw sewage or other solid waste into state waters (3 nautical miles from shore), ocean currents can return discharged sewage, polluted waters and garbage to our shores. Fish do not know boundaries.
Cruise liners also impact air quality. Diesel engines spew out diesel exhaust equivalent to 10,000 cars each day per ship and are kept idling, even when in port.
Another sobering quote from the United Nations Evironmental Programme Tourism website:
quote:
There are 109 countries with coral reefs. In 90 of them reefs are being damaged by cruise ship anchors and sewage, by tourists breaking off chunks of coral, and by commercial harvesting for sale to tourists. One study of a cruise ship anchor dropped in a coral reef for one day found an area about half the size of a football field completely destroyed, and half again as much covered by rubble that died later. It was estimated that coral recovery would take fifty years.
Source: Ocean Planet
Learn more at http://www.uneptie.org/pc/tourism/sust-tourism/env-3main.htm/
Yes, you will find many, many industry press releases online as well, touting how hot diggetty clean and green the cruise ship industry has become. I suggest reading those, too. Progress is being made. Incremental progress, but progress nonetheless.
This is from the Surfridider Foundation, an environmental organization dedicated to preserving the beach:
quote:
We’ve been critical of cruise ships in the past for their generally atrocious environmental record, but credit where credit is due – it looks like some of them are getting the message.
Six Royal Caribbean International and three Celebrity Cruises ships have been awarded Kuoni Travel Group's 2005 Green Planet Award. The award is for their commitment to environmental excellence and innovation.
The ships were recognized for initiatives involving onboard recycling, waste management, energy and fresh water conservation, crew training and guest communications.Despite this, many problems still remain with cruise ships and similar vessels like gambling boats. Our Sebastian Inlet Chapter in Florida is actively campaigning to get the gambling boats to clean up their act.
Nonetheless, here's some more info from Surfrider http://www.surfrider.org/a-z/cruise.asp:
quote:
A 3,000-passenger cruise ship (considered an average size, some carry 5,000 or more passengers) generates the following amounts of waste on a typical one-week voyage:
1 million gallons of "gray water"
210,000 gallons of sewage
25,000 gallons of oily bilge water
Over 100 gallons of hazardous or toxic waste
50 tons of garbage and solid waste
Diesel exhaust emissions equivalent to thousands of automobiles
In addition, these ships take in large quantities of ballast water, which is seawater pumped into the hulls of ships to ensure stability. This water is typically taken in at one port and then discharged at the ship's destination, which can introduce invasive species and serious diseases into U.S. waters. A typical release of ballast water amounts to 1,000 metric tons.
Cruise ships (and other ships) are required to have "marine sanitation devices", which are designed to prevent the discharge of untreated sewage. Sewage must be treated to specified standards before discharge if the ship is stationary of if it is within a specified distance (generally three miles) of shore. When the ship is beyond three miles from shore, there are no restrictions on the release of untreated sewage.
There are no restrictions on the release of gray water, except in the Great Lakes.
Kinda makes you want to go swimming, doesn't it?
I still say-- please find some other way to experience Hawaii -- or anywhere else, for that manner.
We all live on a very small, and very fragile island. I happen to like it a lot, and I'd like to be able to pass it on in as good or better condition than it was in when I drew my first breath a little over a half century ago.
That would truly be a gift to the future.
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Edited by - Mark on 04/08/2007 2:15:24 PM |
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Admin
Pupule
USA
4551 Posts |
Posted - 06/06/2007 : 4:38:35 PM
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| Authentic tourism is and should be catching on. I heard that the Hyatt and Outrigger in Waikiki are adding programs that included Hawaiian music and culture. Let's hope that this is the beginning of a long lasting and permanent trend. |
Andy |
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wcerto
Ahonui
USA
5052 Posts |
Posted - 06/06/2007 : 11:48:34 PM
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Tourism is a business and I believe that the purveyors of the product(s) will provide what the customers wish to purchase. Ergo....in this world, supply and demand....all you've got to do is ask for it. Eventually those who want to make money off tourism will provide the travel experiences that their customers want. If you are one old fut like me, look at Elder Hostel. They have some of the most amazing programs available and it is definitely not the routine touristy stuff...its more a learning experience, and education, and a way to give back. Like for instance in Hawai`i they had a multi-island meet the kupuna trip, or they had a "volunteer at the USS MIssouri trip, to help refurbish...they were lookiing for welders, painters, etc. They had where you could work at Honolulu Zoo for a week; all kinid of swell stuff.
Bottom line...I think folks will get tired of the same old touristy stuff...laying by the pool can be done anywhere, so you don't have to spend lots of airfare to go Hawai`i to do that. The tourist dollars will be spent on definite reasons to travel to those various places. |
Me ke aloha
Malama pono,
Wanda |
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hikabe
Lokahi
USA
358 Posts |
Posted - 06/07/2007 : 03:07:12 AM
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Curious to me that none of you see that tourism is the death of Hawaii's culture. The best way to help the people of Hawaii is to stay away and stop spreading stories of Hawaii that are based on a two week vacation cruise or a stay at the Royal Hawaiian. Hawaii's people don't want tourism. Tourism has already beaten Hawaii's culture to a pulp.
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Stay Tuned... |
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wcerto
Ahonui
USA
5052 Posts |
Posted - 06/07/2007 : 06:07:52 AM
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Hiram and my friends -
Hiram, your words are very strong and bitter.
As we have discussed here many times, those of us who are not native Hawaiians and who do not live in Hawaii, have fallen in love with the beautiful islands and the beautiful people of Hawai`i. It may have been that tourist perception of the perfect paradise Hawai`i that got us there in the first place, but it was the kind and generous and caring people who have made me go back time and again. And it is those people who will have me going back as often as I can afford to.
I am not naive enough to think that Hawai`i is a paradise without problems. However, that goes for wherever people wander in this world. I was born in West Virginia. The regular folks are mighty poor. Economy was not sufficient to raise a family. Shifting from an agriculture based economy, the state could not feed, house or clothe its population. The choice was to work in the coal mines or look outside of the state for work. My father moved our family to Cleveland in the mid-1950’s to find work, as did minions who migrated to Akron, Cleveland, Dayton and Columbus. If you ever went inside a coal mine (a pit-type mine), you would understand in a brief heartbeat why no one would want to earn a living that way…that is if a living really could be earned from it.
These same parallels exist all over the mainland, and yes, even our beloved Hawai`i. I can see from our friends here on TaaroPatch how many have moved to the mainland seeking employment and affordable housing or many have earlier generations of their Hawaiian families who moved to the mainland for the same reasons.
We have gone through the whole litany of reasons why “western” contact with Hawai`i has almost wiped out the kanaka maoli. Just like in West Virginia, the damage has been done. Now the questions remain, can it be fixed and do we want it to be fixed? The state of West Virginia and the people have made conscious decisions to foster tourism. That is the lesser of the evils and does provide economic returns. People do not go to West Virginia for the beautiful beaches and swaying palm trees. People go there now for the natural beauty – the mountains, the creeks, the fast flowing New River, the food, the music, the culture. The folks in West Virginia welcome visitors and welcome the chance to show off their arts and crafts and music and stories and food, etc., and make a bit of money doing so.
I see the same thing happening in Hawai`i. I say the pineapple plantations and the sugar cane plantations and the military desecration of the islands are no different than the coal companies digging out the riches of the earth or stripping it away from the surface of the land. And, both in Hawai`i and West Virginia, as well, plenty folks got rich and even more got poorer and poorer. The folks there were also in danger of losing their heritage. The music of the hills turned into rock and roll. The country music of today in no way remembers the old songs of my childhood. How many of you have mamas who taught you the song “Barbara Allen” because it is a song she grew up with, and one her mother grew up with…and on through the ages? But now things are going back to old times, tempered with modern benefits, as well. The folks can share their history, heritage, music, arts, and food and make a living at it, all the while enjoying the finer things of life such as flush toilets, running water and electricity.
It boils down to two simple things…people want to be able to fill their bellies and they want a roof over their heads. How that gets done is a lifetime’s work. No different in Hawai`i.
We cannot go back in time and erase all the bad things the coal companies did to the people and to the land, anymore than Hawaiians can go back and undue any of the bad things in their history. All we can do is go on from here.
Yes, Hawai’i has been messed with by outsiders, to a degree that shames me. We all know that history as well. Now for the hard part – if the Hawaiian people do not want tourists in order to make a living in a tourist-dependent economy, then what does Hawai`I want?
My nagging question is, then, if the Hawaiians want us to stay away, then what DO they want? Can it be a compromise on both parts? Isn’t it getting better? Don’t more folks want to learn the true history and culture of the islands so they can understand and become attuned to what will honor the `aina and na pua o Hawai`i? I would like to hear specific things from a kama`aina on what we foreigners can do to ho`opono.
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Me ke aloha
Malama pono,
Wanda |
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