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wcerto
Ahonui
USA
5052 Posts |
 Posted - 07/10/2007 : 06:36:59 AM
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I think one of the reasons I really love Hwaiian music is the lack of drums. Modern music uses those synthesized drum sounds which do nothing but create a throbbing headache which pounds in time with the drum beats. It may be just the frequency of the sound that just hits a bad spot in my hears...I really dunno. But slack key, especially has no need for drums as the western world knows them, because you get the rythym from the bass. I don't mean drums like used in hula, or gourds. That is swell...they BELONG. Even though plenty of Hawaiian musicians use electric bass or even electric guitars, I have none seen any of them using a whole big set of drums, ala Ringo Starr or Phil Collins. Well, Bruddah Iz did have drummers/percussionists, but that is about the only one I can think of.
I also like the fact that plenty of Hawaiian musicians still use acoustic stand-up bass. That makes a real pretty sound...mellow, rich and resonant.
Why do you think the lack of "modern" drums in Hawaiian music?
I can think of a few reasons:
1. Hard fo carry da drum set on da back of da horse when paniolo are out in the hills.
2. Drums may have "sacred" cultural connotation -- to be used for specific reasons only.
3. Harsh...doesn't go with the nahenahe.
4. Easy enough to keep time...tap your feet. I once saw in a film of Uncle Ray, with a pillow under his foot when recording. He musta made too much noise for the sound engineer.
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Me ke aloha
Malama pono,
Wanda |
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RWD
`Olu`olu
USA
850 Posts |
Posted - 07/10/2007 : 08:07:58 AM
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| Because, eventualy they all want to play "Wipe-Out" and no one else wants to hear it! haha :) |
Bob |
Edited by - RWD on 07/10/2007 08:19:40 AM |
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wcerto
Ahonui
USA
5052 Posts |
Posted - 07/10/2007 : 09:10:57 AM
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Not even.... at this link from the `ukulele festival, at about 5:40, there are keiki playing Wipe Out on the `ukulele WITHOUT drums.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hd5OYUntmQg |
Me ke aloha
Malama pono,
Wanda |
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Russell Letson
`Olu`olu
USA
504 Posts |
Posted - 07/10/2007 : 09:24:35 AM
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It's not that Hawaiian music lacks drumming so much as that it lacks the American drum kit (which is itself considerably less than a century old). Some recommended listening: "The Best of Hawaiian Slack Key with Gabby Pahinui" (Waikiki WCD-340), which is drawn from a bunch of late-50s Waikiki LPs and singles. It's classic club music, with percussion, keyboards, and steel as well as Gabby's guitar, and it's great stuff--I especially like "Hame Pila" and "I Ka Po Meke Ao." I'm told that Sonny also liked percussion and would play congas himself.
Slack key and Hawaiian string-combo music, like bluegrass and gypsy jazz, generally doesn't need drums to swing, but I've heard all those styles incorporate drumming without losing their characters.
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thumbstruck
Ahonui
USA
2174 Posts |
Posted - 07/10/2007 : 09:47:16 AM
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Another style of music that is mostly drumless is Oberkrainer from the border of Slovenia and Austria. The guitar is the "snare and high-hat" like a mandolin in Bluegrass. Get plenny rhythm in Hawaiian music though, Jack calls the ukulele a 4 string drum kit.
I asked a friend about the prevalence of drums and synth-drums in todays music and he replied that most people aren't up for the intellectual challenge of the nuances of melody and harmony. |
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keoladonaghy
Lokahi
257 Posts |
Posted - 07/10/2007 : 1:06:36 PM
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I love traps drums, and would love to hear more Hawaiian language material using them. I've remixed about 8 of the songs from Kenneth Makuakane's CD with traps drums courtesy Simon Phillips (Toto). We may eventually add other contemporary instrumentation to the songs and release them. Who knows. There is one sample on Nahenahe.net podcast #54. The very last song is a rough remix of Days Gone Bye with drum looks from Mick Fleetwood. That is one of the mellower remixes I've done ;-)
http://mauicast.net/nahenahe/?p=2485
KD |
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Ray Sowders
Akahai
USA
96 Posts |
Posted - 07/10/2007 : 2:11:03 PM
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Most folks don't know that my first instrument is drums. I played for years all over Detroit and S.W. Michigan in a variety of music styles, and made my living that way just before I moved to Hawaii. I had to sell my drum kit a few years after moving here. Sometimes I can just kick myself, but it was something that just had to be done. Here in Hawaii, most "drummers" don't play the size drums that I needed in Detroit just to get gigs. (I called them toy drums) My floor tom was bigger then most guys kick drums! When I had people come over to take a look at my kit, when I was trying to sell them...they would have one look...and I'd watch their eyes get real big! Same question kept coming up..."what are those?"..I'd say REAL drums ha! For Hawaiian music, I would never say never. Some folks have used them in their recordings. I think it should be an individual thing, and must be used with taste or not at all. Sometimes it is a good thing to break some of the "rules" instead of just doing what everybody else does. All I know is I miss playing them from time to time. But, my neighbors don't miss them at all!
Ray |
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wcerto
Ahonui
USA
5052 Posts |
Posted - 07/10/2007 : 3:50:47 PM
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Ray - you are the man of many talents! I don't remember if I told you how much we enjoyed your gig at Tiki's when we went O`ahu. We surely loved it! I could tell that the rest of the crowd there enjoyed it very much, as well. I am almost finished my scrapbooking pics of the scenery and stuff. Next I am going to work on all the music pics I took and put them in a separate album.
Keola - I really enjoyed Days Gone Bye. The drums were not obtrusive. They fit. And they didn't sound like synthesized stuff. And they weren't the same boring, repetitious beat over and over and over, ad naseum. Plus, I enjoy listening to your podcasts in the `olelo. I'm getting better at being able to understand the spoken word. For me, normal conversation is much harder because goes faster. Plus, it don't gots no "ha`ina". I was wracking my brain trying to figure out what Hawaiian word is "say-day". First of all, didn't know the "S" sound would have been there. I had to break down and read the translation. Hah! Languages are always evolving to account for modern times and emerging technologies.
Plus Hoku Zuttermeister was so good...such a sweet voice.
Anyhow, my whole point in this long missive, is that the drums went well and were appropriate in this mele. It is more contemporary of a tune, obviously, since it talks about the old times...Days Gone Bye. |
Me ke aloha
Malama pono,
Wanda |
Edited by - wcerto on 07/10/2007 3:51:44 PM |
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Russell Letson
`Olu`olu
USA
504 Posts |
Posted - 07/10/2007 : 8:47:25 PM
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Hah--just thought of another interesting example, Milt Holland's very restrained, very swinging brushwork (added in post-production, I believe) on the Gabby-Atta duet "How'd Ya Do" on the Gabby Band Vol. 2 album. As with the Waikiki arrangements, this is from the Hawaiian swing-pop tradition, where the drumkit is quite appropriate.
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Ray Sowders
Akahai
USA
96 Posts |
Posted - 07/11/2007 : 11:21:27 AM
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I almost forgot to mention a example of bad taste...did you remember the drummer on "I'll Remember You" by Kui Lee? He was playing so much rim in some sections that he sounded like the Budweiser horses galloping by. I'm surprised no body knocked him off his drum throne. I'd have been proud to! THAT is an example of what NOT to do. Many others come to mind but, I'm feeling gracious today...
Ray
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rendesvous1840
Ha`aha`a
USA
1055 Posts |
Posted - 07/11/2007 : 11:49:48 AM
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What we all want to know is: What's the Hawaiian version/equivalent of Innagoddadavita? And how long was the drum solo?Inquiring minds want to know.
Paul |
"A master banjo player isn't the person who can pick the most notes.It's the person who can touch the most hearts." Patrick Costello |
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thumbstruck
Ahonui
USA
2174 Posts |
Posted - 07/11/2007 : 1:43:03 PM
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| To play back up is to play so that people won't notice you, but if you're not there, they notice the hole left by your absence. Salt on a pretzle. |
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wcerto
Ahonui
USA
5052 Posts |
Posted - 07/12/2007 : 03:39:36 AM
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| Lots of drums in Ken Makuakane's "Ku`u Home o Manoa". Keola - did you have anything to do with that? I've just rediscovered that mele on a compilation CD from Norwegian Cruise Lines that we bought when we first went hele Hawai`i. |
Me ke aloha
Malama pono,
Wanda |
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slipry1
Ha`aha`a
USA
1511 Posts |
Posted - 07/12/2007 : 05:50:22 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by thumbstruck
To play back up is to play so that people won't notice you, but if you're not there, they notice the hole left by your absence. Salt on a pretzle.
That's part of "sideman consciousness" - be invisible until the leader says "take it" and then pop out of hyperspace, do your solo, and pop back into hyoperspace again. I love it! |
keaka |
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Retro
Ahonui
USA
2368 Posts |
Posted - 07/12/2007 : 07:43:25 AM
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| Sidebar to thumbstruck & slipry1's points (and these guys know of what they speak...er, type) --- when playing for hula dancers, the band NEVER does anything that would draw attention away from the dancing. We've had a drummer play with us on occasion, and it worked fine. Experienced musicians know what works and what doesn't; it's not about knowing what to play - it's about knowing what NOT to play. |
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wcerto
Ahonui
USA
5052 Posts |
Posted - 07/12/2007 : 08:53:13 AM
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| I have often said that to understand the music of a culture, you've got to understand the dance(s). Hula...polka....salsa....clogging... |
Me ke aloha
Malama pono,
Wanda |
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