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RJS
Ha`aha`a
1635 Posts |
 Posted - 05/12/2005 : 2:42:55 PM
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This isn't exactly about sharing TAB, but I do understand some people's frustration about not being able to get stuff.
I've been wondering if something else isn't also at play. Note - I'm not attributing this to any specific person -- just a "wondering." Slack key can sound simple. It's also the kind of thing that when it bites you, you want to learn it. However, it does take time to learn to play slack key. Even to get to an "advanced beginner" status, it takes time. Maybe some of the frustration expressed about TAB is frustration at how hard it really is to learn to play this style? |
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Kiwini
Lokahi
USA
203 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2005 : 3:05:20 PM
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Aloha Kakou,
You guys never seem to stop impressing me with you insights and your eloquent way of stating your positions. Seems everyone has valid points in their own rights. As for me, I will carry on with your words always near to my heart as I do all things Hawaiian.
Congratulations Lokahi Mike!!
Mahalo Nui,
Kiwini
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Me Ke Aloha,
Steve |
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Admin
Pupule
USA
4551 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2005 : 3:15:30 PM
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Aloha everyone. I probably should have chimed in earlier but sometimes it's good just to sit back and see how things play out. Nice to see everyone is civilized and clear in putting out their respective views.
For starters, the following is a quote that appeared in the Taropatch.net FAQ until fairly recently. You see, when I upgraded the forum software, the FAQ went back to the default questions/answers and I haven't had a chance to figure out how to restore my own FAQ with the new version.quote:
Taropatch.net does not allow its members to broadcast offers or requests for illegally copied materials to its community. Although this site supports the perpetuation of slack key guitar and `ukulele traditions in many ways, Taropatch.net must protect itself from the potential legal problems associated with copyright infringement of published materials. We believe there is too much good here to risk losing over intellectual property issues. Moreover, it is important to respect the works of artists and teachers so that they may come and share in the aloha and information exchange here too.
Original works by Taropatch.net members, works in public domain, and/or those used with the necessary written permissions of the original artist/publishers may be posted. All others may not be posted. Thank you for complying with this policy and making this website a friendly, informative and interesting resource.
Reality is that this is a complex issue and not because I want tunings to be secretive. It's not a lack of aloha or lack of desire to share this music that we all love so much.
Everyone has made great points. I cannot say that I deagree with any of the diverse points you have made. To date, I've been on the hardline side but point to main motivation to protect this site and myself. And I've taken this stance because I'd rather err on the side of caution and not take risks in this ever growing litigious society. Hopefully, this makes sense.
Ps. I am not completely fixed in my opinion. Recently, have had some dialogue with those who would like to share learning materials with efforts to take the right steps. I hope that they realize that I am totally open to hearing opinions differing from my own and I'm listening. |
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poipicker
Aloha
8 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2005 : 8:28:24 PM
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WOW!,
I just got back from a trip and checked out my original post. I can't believe the response. After 3 pages of posts, I feel I have to respond.
I have been playing guitar for my own pleasure and with my family all of my life. I heard Keola's music and thought "I would love to learn how to play that." While deployed to help with the Tsunami relief, I spent 4 days during free time learning one song. It was great. But it was hard to pick up the positions the notes were played on. I wondered if there was an easier position to play the song on. I don't think I have it quite right yet...
I PURCHASED:
1. "Keola Beamer Teaches Hawaiian Slack Key" and purchased the on-line lessons Keola offers. (almost have Moana's Laundry Basket down)
2. Hawaiian Slack Key Guitar Instrumental Collection
3. John Keawe Auhele
4. Keola Beamer Tales from the Dream Guitar
5. Slack Key Guitar vol 1
6. Slack Key Guitar vol 2
7. Keola Beamer Moana Kea White Mountain Journal
8. Hawaiian Slack Key Guitar Masters Collection vol 2
9. Charles Michael Brotman Pacific Rendezvous
When I posted the request to locate Tabs, it was because I was looking for more material to help me to play Slack Key. I was not looking for any free material. I was looking for your recommendations.
I can't say it any better than Kiwini did in his response to my post.
Kiwini replied:
"I hope I can speak for Poipicker and others as I do for myself that when we ask for tabs, please don't assume we are asking for free music so that we can exploit it. Please don't assume that we don't respect the right for reputable artists to make a living off what they do professionally. Think instead that maybe we are simply asking help in the "process" of attaining music tabs to help us study, learn and promote the beautiful sound of Kiho'alu, in hopes that those who have toiled their whole lives at the art can continue to reap more of what they sow. Not in illegal material but in copywrited material legally for sale."
Also, I have played a few songs for friends and now they are asking me where to buy Slack Key music in California. I hope that my purchases and those of my friends will benefit the artists and the proliferation of slack key guitar.
When I joined, I hoped to find friends to enjoy Slack Key with. My first post was looking for someone to play with in Kailua. Go check out the replies to that post. My second post was this one.
Thank you to all who offered support and suggestions.
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hapakid
Luna Ho`omalu
USA
1533 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2005 : 08:40:10 AM
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Welcome back poipicker!
Yeah, the TAB subject came up and it got tense for a few moments, but aloha reigns once again.
Jesse Tinsley |
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cmdrpiffle
`Olu`olu
USA
553 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2005 : 12:57:27 PM
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Okay John,
I'm impressed. What'd that take? 4-5 hours? |
my Poodle is smarter than your honor student |
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alasdair
Aloha
Germany
22 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2005 : 1:46:53 PM
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quote:
Okay John,
<br>
I'm impressed. What'd that take? 4-5 hours?
 ROTFL
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poipicker
Aloha
8 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2005 : 4:29:39 PM
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JWN,
Thanks for the Pinch harmonic technique. I burn along on the song and then go to "super slow" for the pinch harmonics. I even skipped the pinch portion and played a different way to be able to motor through the song. Keola says, "you have room to make the song you own" and if it was gonna get done, I had to contrive something. Your technique sounds lots better than mine and I can do it and stay in time. Thanks for taking the time.
aloha
POIPICKER |
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poipicker
Aloha
8 Posts |
Posted - 05/14/2005 : 11:15:51 AM
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Lokahi,
I got it down, and can play the tune through for the first time. I spent a lot of time trying to accomplish Keola's method, but got to the point where I wasn't sure it was worth it. Your way sounds great and I stay in time... Thanks again for the technique... Ever try to play Beamer's Ku'u Morning Dew? Any thoughts on that song would be much appreciated.
Thanks
Brad
quote:
Originally posted by jwn
quote:
Originally opined by poipicker
...almost have Moana's Laundry Basket down...
Okay PoiPicker. This is your thread, and you brought up a tune... so, maybe I can nuke two birds with one boulder.
Bear with me...
When is a tab not a tab? You know how we've been gruntin' and groanin' about "sharing" and "what's right" vs. "what's wrong". Well, I've got an idea (sometimes that can be bad... very, very bad)... but, how's about an alternate way of playing a semi-difficult part in your pre-mentioned tune?
What I want to show you is, is a variation for those pinch harmonics that makes life a whole lot simpler. I'm gonna show you how I play it, with a sorta quazi, half-arsed tab and/or explanation. Here's my weird notation:
T,t - thumb
I,i - index
M,m - middle
R,r - ring
P,p - pinkie (don't worry, I won't make you use it)
Capitals are the left (fretting) hand and lowercase are the right (plucking) hand. There'll be four letters/numbers for each note separated by a colon. The first character is the left hand digit to use (or open). The second position character is the string we're playing (1st being at the bottom, the skinniest one, and the 6th being at the top, the fattest string). The third character in the sequence is the fret. The last character is which right hand digit to use. I only include this to make it simpler. I suppose you can pluck with whatever finger/thumb you want... but you might get a little tangled up, so I stuck it in.
For an example, if I write: I : 6 : 3 : t ... I'm trying to say, "left index finger on the 6th string, 3rd fret, pluck with right thumb". Dig it? When I mean for an open string to be plucked, I'll denote that with a "0" (zero). If a string is open, there'll always be two zeros in the notes notation. Example: R : 2 : 7 : m ... or, "left ring finger on the 2nd string, 7th fret, pluck with right middle finger". Can you dig that? And, 0 : 3 : 0 : t means: "pluck an open 3rd string with your right thumb". How easy is that?
Okay, so now that you've bought your Keola book, turn to Page 23, measures 42 and 43. (Heck, maybe this'll even make a few sales for da man. As a matter of fact everybody else who hasn't bought one yet, just buy it... I don't think you'll regret it.)
As far as this story goes, I'll probably end up making this a lot longer than I intended, but hey, it IS for free (for my part anyway). So, pull up a stump (or whatever), grab yer geetar, yer songbook (or just listen up for now), and let's go...
Measure 42 my way (there are only 5 notes to play, one note being comprised of two notes played together):
0 : 5 : 0 : t
I : 4 : 12 : t
0 : 2 : 0 : m
I : 4 : 12 : i ..... R : 5 : 14 : t
M : 2 : 12(h) : m
Let me take the time to explain exactly what's going on (so from now on I won't have to).
The first note is a sixteenth beat, second an eight beat, third a sixteenth, fourth (both) an eight and the fifth note is an eight note harmonic.
First note: "open 5th string, pluck with right thumb".
Second note: "left index finger on the 4th string, 12th fret, plucked with right thumb".
Third note: "open 2nd string, pluck with right middle finger".
The fourth note is two notes played together:- first of the two: "left index finger on the 4th string, 12th fret, pluck with right index".
- second of the two: "left ring finger on the 5th string, 14th fret, pluck with the right thumb".
That last one is: "left middle finger plays a harmonic on the 2nd string, 12 fret, pluck with the right hand's middle finger".
It sounds complicated, but it isn't. And in fact, I cheat... I don't play the two-note combination. Here's what I do:
0 : 5 : 0 : t
I : 4 : 12 : t
0 : 2 : 0 : m
I : 4 : 12 : t
M : 2 : 12(h) : m
Sounds very close, and you can hit it a whole lot quicker.
The really nice thing about this is, the harmonic rings and rings and rings. Even when you moving to the next set of notes, that harmonic is ringing still. Speaking of the next set of notes... on to measure 43.
Again, five notes (two of which are two notes sounded together).
0 : 6 : 0 : t
I : 4 : 10 : t
0 : 2 : 0 : m
I : 4 : 10 : i ... M : 5 : 11 : t
P : 1 : 12(h) : r
Okay, so I lied about your pinkie... but you can use your left ring finger to hit that harmonic if you want. I just find it easier to drop my pinkie down on it. It's cleaner and that's what you're after.
Truth be known, I cheat on this one too. I do:
0 : 6 : 0 : t
I : 4 : 10 : t
0 : 2 : 0 : m
I : 4 : 10 : t
R : 1 : 12(h) : r
Whew. There ya go... no "pinch" harmonics". I first learned this song using the pinch harmonics, and it does take some practice... okay, a lot of practice. But I've since switched to my lazy way and can play the measures without bozo-ing it like I used to. And I do hope I haven't introduced too many errors in this long-winded diatribe. Give it a shot... let me know if this is of any use.
There is one thing though... I see why we use tabs.
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wdf
Ha`aha`a
USA
1153 Posts |
Posted - 05/15/2005 : 05:38:01 AM
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| poipicker, you have email. |
Dusty |
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poipicker
Aloha
8 Posts |
Posted - 05/15/2005 : 2:53:10 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by jwn
quote:
Curiously posted by one Aloha-on-da-poster-scale:
Lokahi...
I've been called many things... but... What the heck is a Lokahi? er, Lok Ahi... (Scottish lake for yellow-fin?)
quote:
poipicker queried me further:
Ever try to play Beamer's Ku'u Morning Dew?
Ummm... yah. It's a very pretty arrangement of a gorgeous tune. What exactly would you like to know? Whether there's a tab for it, or not? Yes, there is... you have to get it from Keola though. Email him through his website (use the mailing list link and add a comment asking how you might be able to get a tab of the song). I'm sure he'll answer back if you show an interest.
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catheglass
Lokahi
USA
312 Posts |
Posted - 05/15/2005 : 8:55:49 PM
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Okies, i'm not gonna dip into the swamp around this issue, either. My question is for Nancy.
<BEG> Hey girlfriend, if the demographic for this site is retired white male, wha' choo doin' here?
Hmmm, and what am I???? Be seein' you at camp, with aloha, |
cathe |
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Auntie Nancy
`Olu`olu
USA
593 Posts |
Posted - 05/15/2005 : 10:38:24 PM
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Hangin' out having fun wit folks like chu!
Look forward to meeting you soon!!
I was put out... at the assumptions made at the beginning...
all better now.
hugs n thanks -
n |
nancy cook |
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Admin
Pupule
USA
4551 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2005 : 10:59:48 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Auntie Nancy
I was put out... at the assumptions made at the beginning...
all better now.
Good. Need some wahines here to keep us in line. And to keep it clean for the mixed company!  |
Andy |
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Ken
Aloha
USA
12 Posts |
Posted - 05/25/2005 : 06:52:12 AM
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Aloha!
In regards to tablature and other teaching materials:
Solving the sharing of tab and the general problem of protecting the performers and at the same time encouraging and spreading the instruction of slack key, was a motivating factor in the formation of the Slack Key Preservation Society (SKPS).
As long as someone could financially benefit from the material generated by others, there is always a risk to the performers that they would, somehow, lose out.
As a non-profit organization, where none of the officers or directors receive a penny, it is anticipated that SKPS will be a repository of teaching information, including tab, teaching videos, recordings of performances and more.
The Hawaiian professionals are generous, sharing people and want to share slack key and do. However, as stated previously, they have been ripped-off in more ways than one. Nevertheless, they are still trusting. Tablature is commonly given out in teaching seminars and with the purchase of books and videos.
SKPS has filmed and produced two teaching DVD's/videos by George Kahumoku, Jr. and one by Ozzie Kotani, which have not yet been released. These and other performers trust that nothing held by SKPS will be released without their approval.
When SKPS does release teaching material, any income generated will be used to benefit the performers and/or provide further concerts/workshops, etc., futhering the teaching and preservation of slack key. Thus, the performers/authors of tab and other teaching materials can share their talents and knowledge without risk through SKPS.
SKPS looks forward to releasing these DVD's/videos in the near future.
If you have any tablature, videos, teaching materials, etc. that you would like to preserve for the future benefit of slack key, you might consider donating it to SKPS. SKPS will be working with authors and performers to arrange for distribution of such works with the consent of the rightful owner(s). SKPS will not release any materials without the owner's/performer's consent.
Aloha!
Ken Armstrong
www.skps.org
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Ken Armstrong |
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