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alika207
Ha`aha`a
USA
1260 Posts |
 Posted - 04/29/2007 : 2:33:06 PM
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Pua Lokelani
(Composed by Alex "Alika" Krauth and Alana Chow, Dedicated to Keali'i Blaisdell, edited by Keola Donaghy)
'Auhea wale 'oe, Hear me1
e ku'u pua lokelani My precious rose flower
'O ka pua nani nö 'oe You are the truly beautiful flower
i ku'u pu'uwai Of my affections
Ho'ohihi ka mana'o My thoughts are entranced
i ke 'ala pua loke By the fragrance of the rose blossom
He pua mae'ole 'oe You are a never wilting flower
I kui 'ia a lei That is strung as a lei
He lei kaulana 'oe You are a famous flower
i kau a‘e i ka hano That is raised in glory
Onaona i ka ihu Fragrant when smelled
Ke 'ala ahe mälie The gently wafting fragrance
Ha'ina 'ia mai Told
ana ka puana Is the story.
'Auhea wale 'oe, Hear me
e ku'u pua lokelani My precious rose flower
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He kehau ho'oma'ema'e ke aloha.
'Alika / Polinahe |
Edited by - alika207 on 02/18/2008 12:22:29 PM |
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keoladonaghy
Lokahi
257 Posts |
Posted - 04/29/2007 : 5:34:06 PM
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> a me he lei kaulana
You generally do not see "me" before "he" in this context:
A he lei kaulana
> Ha'ina ia mai
Ha'ina 'ia mai |
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alika207
Ha`aha`a
USA
1260 Posts |
Posted - 04/29/2007 : 11:41:45 PM
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| Mahalo nui loa, e Keola! I just changed that. |
He kehau ho'oma'ema'e ke aloha.
'Alika / Polinahe |
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Sarah
`Olu`olu
571 Posts |
Posted - 04/30/2007 : 06:13:00 AM
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Lovely sentiment...
Perhaps you mean "ke 'ala" -- fragrance? |
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alika207
Ha`aha`a
USA
1260 Posts |
Posted - 04/30/2007 : 12:04:22 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Sarah
Lovely sentiment...
Perhaps you mean "ke 'ala" -- fragrance?
'Ae, I do. |
He kehau ho'oma'ema'e ke aloha.
'Alika / Polinahe |
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alika207
Ha`aha`a
USA
1260 Posts |
Posted - 05/02/2007 : 1:51:17 PM
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| Why isn't it ka 'ala? The word starts with an okina. |
He kehau ho'oma'ema'e ke aloha.
'Alika / Polinahe |
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Reid
Ha`aha`a
Andorra
1526 Posts |
Posted - 05/02/2007 : 2:13:16 PM
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Sarah is busy right now.
...Sarah's squeeze |
Edited by - Reid on 05/02/2007 2:14:26 PM |
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marzullo
`Olu`olu
USA
923 Posts |
Posted - 05/02/2007 : 3:31:06 PM
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quote:
Why isn't it ka 'ala? The word starts with an okina
it actually starts with an 'okina 
there are some words that don't always follow the KEAO rule - eg, we were taught to say ke päkaukau (the dictionary says "1. n. Table, counter, stand, booth, desk; formerly a long mat on which food was placed (kaukau) (occasionally preceded by ke)". as for 'ala, the dictionary says "1. vs. Fragrant, sweet-smelling, perfumed; fragrance, perfume (preceded by ke)".
i remember this exception by recalling danny ka'opio's great song Ke 'Ala O Ka Rose...
aloha,
keith
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Edited by - marzullo on 05/02/2007 3:32:57 PM |
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Sarah
`Olu`olu
571 Posts |
Posted - 05/03/2007 : 03:37:50 AM
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'Alika,
I've never learned *why* it is ke 'ala, but it is... Big help I am, I know  Maybe someone like Keola D., who knows a great deal linguistically, might know about the actual reason for the exception.
As Keith pointed out, there are a number of exceptions to that rule of thumb KEAO.
A lot of the exceptions begin with p, I have noticed, such as ke po'o, ke päkaukau, ke pä, etc. Sometimes a word has different meanings depending on whether ke or ka is used. In addition (and this is just my observation) it seems that sometimes the older meaning takes ka and the more modern meaning takes ke -- as if it is to help distinguish among meanings for a word that has many. Take pä, for instance, and see the variation:
pä
1. nvi. Fence, wall, corral, pen, sty, enclosure, courtyard, patio, arena, (house) lot, yard, extremity; to build a fence, enclosure. Cf. pänini, Pä-lama (place name), fence built of lama wood. Mai këlä pä o ka honua, a mai këlä pä o ka lani mai (Mar. 13.27), from that end of the earth and from that end of the heavens. (PPN paa.)
2. n. Dish, plate, pan; elongated food bowl used for meat or fish; flat basin; phonograph record, disk (preceded by ke). Cf. halepä.
3. n. Mother-of-pearl shell (Pinctada margaritifera); pearl-shell lure; fishhook (cf. pä 'i'o, pä kau ulua). Both ke and ka are used with pä 3. Pä ä eo, a successful pä lure. Pä hau, shell with white on inside. Pä mae, variegated shell; lit., faded shell. (PPN paa.)
There are some words that seem to use either: ke mele or ka mele, ka hoa or ke hoa. For instance, in "Ahe Lau Makani", ke hoa is used.
Back to ke 'ala. The dictionary notes that it is preceded by ke. Meaning 2., however, does not note that, and I would assume then (please correct me if I am wrong) that meaning 2. takes ka, yielding ka 'ala, which refers to a type of taro, quite different from a fragrance 
As I recall, in one of the language texts (I think it may be Nä Kai 'Ewalu) one is urged to memorize the vocabulary with the article. However tedious this might seem, what with one ka after another, this means one learns to use the correct article even with an exception.
But I like Keith's method: remembering from hearing a lovely song.
aloha,
Sarah |
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keoladonaghy
Lokahi
257 Posts |
Posted - 05/03/2007 : 07:48:50 AM
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Whenever my wife asks "why is it like this?" the answer is simple... because that is how native speakers did it. There is not always a linguistic explanation, and as you poined out, Sarah, there are also variations.
There are a number of words that start with 'okina that take ke instead of ka. Three that pop to mind immediately are ke 'ala, ke 'a'ali'i, ke 'ö. There are a few "p" words as well - po'o, päkaukau, puna and pä come to mind. When I was in third year, a few of us in class started using "ke pahi" for some reason. Maybe it made sense as everything else at the kitchen table - ke päkaukau (table), ke pä (plate), ke puna (spoon) and ke 'ö (fork) all took "ke" contrary to the KEAO guidelines, however, pahi still takes ka.
Re: hoa. Usually I see and hear "hoa" with ke if hoa is by itself - e ke hoa. If there is something else, hoaaloha, hoa pili, hoa hale, then I usually hear "ka hoaaloha", etc. For mele, ke is more common in writing and spoken these days, but I've also heard ka. Almeida used "ke" consistently in the interviews I've heard of him.
Some of these differences may be to differentiate meanings. Ke mele = song. Ka mele = yellow (yes, melemele is more common but mele is also known. The argument for this is weak, however, as there are many Hawaiian words with multiple meanings, and you can only differentiate them by context.
Some kupuna use "ka" almost exclusively where we tend to use these exceptions, and some others where ke would normally be spoken. I am familiar with one native speaker who uses ka kula, ka kahakai, ka mele, etc.
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alika207
Ha`aha`a
USA
1260 Posts |
Posted - 05/03/2007 : 10:01:42 AM
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Wow!
Hiki mai, this is off subject but going along with all this 'olelo stuff: When you want to make a noun plural that starts with a, what do you do? Do you just proceed it with na, or is it na ke? I've heard some mele with the words "na ke aloha" in them. Personally, I don't think na aloha sounds that maika'i because there is no okina before the a in aloha to break the words up. |
He kehau ho'oma'ema'e ke aloha.
'Alika / Polinahe |
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keoladonaghy
Lokahi
257 Posts |
Posted - 05/03/2007 : 2:26:25 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by hawaiianmusicfan138
Wow!
Hiki mai, this is off subject but going along with all this 'olelo stuff: When you want to make a noun plural that starts with a, what do you do? Do you just proceed it with na, or is it na ke? I've heard some mele with the words "na ke aloha" in them. Personally, I don't think na aloha sounds that maika'i because there is no okina before the a in aloha to break the words up.
To pluralize a common noun, ka or ke, you use nä with the kahakö.
Na without kahako, as in your example, means "by", "from" or "for".
He makana na ke aloha - a gift from (or for) the beloved (one). You would need more context than just this sentence to know which it was, my suspicion is more often that not it would be "for".
It can also mean "belongs to" "Na Keola keia kamepiula". This computer belongs to Keola.
HTH |
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Sarah
`Olu`olu
571 Posts |
Posted - 05/04/2007 : 04:07:05 AM
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quote:
Personally, I don't think na aloha sounds that maika'i because there is no okina before the a in aloha to break the words up
This kind of "elision" or joining is a common phenomenon, however, and whether it sounds good or not is kinda irrelevant -- it's the way the language is. As Keola said, nä (with a kahakö) is the plural article, regardless of whether the next word begins with a vowel or a consonant. It is something that English speakers have to get used to, though, since it isn't an issue in English.
I remember needing to practice saying "nä i'a" (the fish-pl.) quite a bit, to get the 'okina in the right place and not accidentally say nä 'i'a
There is a text book with such exercises in pronunciation in it -- I think it is either Kahananui's E Kama'ilio Kakou or Wight's Learning Hawaiian at Home -- which just goes to show that yes, a student needs to practice this particular feature of the language!
Aloha,
Sarah |
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marzullo
`Olu`olu
USA
923 Posts |
Posted - 05/04/2007 : 05:08:38 AM
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being gentle with the 'okina is hard too... i still struggle with "ka 'ao'ao 'akau" - i sound like i'm strangling when i say it. 
aloha,
keith
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alika207
Ha`aha`a
USA
1260 Posts |
Posted - 05/04/2007 : 09:47:11 AM
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| I know it has a kahako, but what I hate is that it doesn't want to show up when I type sometimes. It is so weird because it does show up in some places and not in others. For instance, when I write leka uila, it comes up in the subject but not in the message body. It drives me pupule. Oh well. Please forgive me. |
He kehau ho'oma'ema'e ke aloha.
'Alika / Polinahe |
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keoladonaghy
Lokahi
257 Posts |
Posted - 05/04/2007 : 11:26:33 AM
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Testing Hawaiian.
Hawaiian keyboard on Mac - ÄÄ“Ä«ÅÅ« ʻĀĒĪŌŪ
Using escape sequences- #256;, #257;, #274;, #275;, #298;, #299;, #332;, #333;, #362;, #363;, #145;,
Andy, feel free to delete this message, I'll explain to people how to do this later if it works.
Keola |
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