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RWD
`Olu`olu
USA
850 Posts |
 Posted - 09/17/2008 : 02:18:37 AM
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| I must be tired all the time :) |
Bob |
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Mark
Ha`aha`a
USA
1628 Posts |
Posted - 09/17/2008 : 08:45:13 AM
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quote:
To quote from Keola Beamer and Mark Nelson's seminal instruction book, "Learn to Play Hawaiian Slack-Key Guitar, "This takes some time; at least practice half an hour a day. If you can't do that, then, why don't you just put this book in the bottom of your parrot cage, or something!"
I'm working with the publisher to reprint the book on softer, more absorbent paper.
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GUke
Lokahi
188 Posts |
Posted - 09/19/2008 : 09:59:36 AM
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First I consider myself more a singer who plays to accompany. A great performer told me that she leaves the paaniʻs to the rest of the musicians. When you first start to play it does take a lot of effort and discipline. You need to get your fingers calloused and remember chord positions, and flowing from chord to chord. Then thereʻs timing. And then the song to play.
Okay, Iʻm passed all that. And I can carry a tune which makes it easier for me to learn a song, cause Iʻm free from listening to a recording. When I practice these days, it depends on what I want to accomplish. If itʻs a new song, then Iʻll practice that piece, until I feel I can get from start to end with few mistakes. Sometimes a song will present a chord flow Iʻm not accustomed to, so Iʻll go over that part over and over and over etc.
There are songs that I like and want to play better. So Iʻll practice those songs again and again. Or just play them.
My practices vary, but I do try to pick up an instrument daily. And usually Iʻll practice a piece Iʻm learning. I still need the crutch of a chart -- lyrics and chords. And maybe thatʻs my next goal -- to play from memory. But as I started gigging, it was more to be able to play and sing with the chart as opposed to playing from memory, especially when having to play over 50+ songs now. Because I donʻt read music, but more so find it difficult to translate written music to the rhythm of the song, I have at times learned the tune of the song incorrectly. (Itʻs easier for me to hear a song performed.) Or sometimes trying to chart a song from ear I donʻt find the right chord.
I will agree that whenever you can itʻs great to play with others. But if the others are well ahead, some do find that intimidating. I am fortunate to be in the SF Bay Area where kanikapilas and open mikes regularly occur. So being able to participate in those was a goal that encouraged me to practice a lot. And the kanikapilas not only introduced but the playing of a song many many times, help me learn them. Especially the mele in Hawaiian. It also helps to have a collection of Hawaiian CDʻs to fall back on too.
At times when I feel l canʻt get through a new piece Iʻm learning or trying to improve, Iʻll play one of my favorite tunes that I play well. I find that break re-energizes me and reminds me what Iʻm trying to accomplish.
My current goal is to sing and double strum the ukulele at the same time. Getting there s--l---o----w-----l------y.
Whether you sing and play, or just play put the effort in to get over the initial hump -- building up callouses, chord positions, scales (not for me), or learning that first song you like (even if that first song is difficult). Once thatʻs accomplish learning other songs become a bit easier. And as mentioned earlier, enjoy it. |
Genaro
Should I? Itʻs only $, and where Iʻm going itʻll burn or melt. |
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APT
Aloha
34 Posts |
Posted - 09/19/2008 : 12:20:39 PM
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Wow, it has been enlightening to read all of these replies. So here are two more questions for you folks:
1) How do you handle mistakes?
I'm not new to guitar, but I am new to slack key. Although I think that I am doing better with slack key than I did in my former guitar life, it is still frustrating when I make mistakes, especially when I thought that I had a song down pat. Then I watch Braddah Duke on YouTube, and he plays so effortlessly! Here I am grimacing at every tough patch, and the good Braddah doesn't even change facial expressions!
2) What causes mistakes? Seriously, how can I play a section smoothly one day and then botch it the next? How can I have a section nailed -- with no apparent issues -- and then completely mess up the next day? Is it lack of concentration? What the heck causes this to happen?
Any responses are appreciated! |
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noeau
Ha`aha`a
USA
1105 Posts |
Posted - 09/19/2008 : 3:49:42 PM
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| Right on Duke. Das how. Jus play da kine and make errybody feel gud. |
No'eau, eia au he mea pa'ani wale nō. |
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RWD
`Olu`olu
USA
850 Posts |
Posted - 09/19/2008 : 5:11:36 PM
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I have just started playing out but so far I have seen two types of situations:
1) playing a solo performance in front of a quiet attentive audience full of musicians is a serious and stressfull situation.
2) every thing else is meant for fun. People go to have fun, like a drinking party where no one cares. When someone plays guitar it gets better.
Avoid the 1st situation and practice like you are expecting the 2nd. Always play your best but it is more important to parctice making you music joyfull and getting that across.
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Bob |
Edited by - RWD on 09/19/2008 5:30:55 PM |
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RJS
Ha`aha`a
1635 Posts |
Posted - 09/19/2008 : 5:41:49 PM
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Not knowing the piece, overthinking, stress/anxiety, inattention .....
Really, mistakes are overrated. Especially if you can "personalize" each song, or do some improving/pa'ani work ... your audience will probably not even know when you make a small mistake or not .... UNLESS... you draw attention to it. The biggest problem with mistakes is that we tend to get tight after making one, and that sets us up for other mistakes, or changes in rhythm, tempo, groove ... take it in stride, use it as a jumping off point for improv .. almost no one will notice (And the folks that do notice are the same guys who make their own mistakes, so no worry there.) The important thing is the feeling, the groove. Keep in it and people will love you and you'll have fun.
I used to have season tickets with Chicago Symphony .. .the best musicians in the world make mistakes. But the best musicians in the world also give you such a beautiful sonic and emotional experience that mistakes are no big deal. |
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hikabe
Lokahi
USA
358 Posts |
Posted - 09/19/2008 : 7:03:22 PM
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Some of us are cursed/blessed with the ability to hear every mistake any musician makes and cannot be fooled. To err is human. Everyone makes mistakes. No big deal sometimes, but sometimes there are serious circumstances. A professional musician should not be making mistakes on a regular basis. Amatuers are expected and forgiven. But not professionals. Professionals get paid not to make mistakes. If you are playing at a jam session or kani or hootenany, no big deal to make mistakes, try not to. If you are with the Philharmonic, your fired. That is a harsh reality for those who have dedicated their lives to perfection. People who are in orchestras do not and cannot make mistakes.
Everyone has the ability to reach the higher standards set by the greats. There are many factors that keep us from that plateau.
How to avoid mistakes? Blood, sweat and tears. If you make a mistake then you don't really know the piece at all.
Advice... If you are a performer, play what you know. Don't take a chance on something you don't have completely down pat. If you are just jamming, keep messing up until you get it right. But don't accept the notion that it is ok. Practice, practice, practice, practice sober. |
Stay Tuned... |
Edited by - hikabe on 09/19/2008 7:06:22 PM |
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cpatch
Ahonui
USA
2187 Posts |
Posted - 09/20/2008 : 06:51:57 AM
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| Mistakes are just an opportunity to learn. |
Craig
My goal is to be able to play as well as people think I can. |
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slipry1
Ha`aha`a
USA
1511 Posts |
Posted - 09/20/2008 : 07:13:29 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by hikabe
Some of us are cursed/blessed with the ability to hear every mistake any musician makes and cannot be fooled. To err is human. Everyone makes mistakes. No big deal sometimes, but sometimes there are serious circumstances. A professional musician should not be making mistakes on a regular basis. Amatuers are expected and forgiven. But not professionals. Professionals get paid not to make mistakes. If you are playing at a jam session or kani or hootenany, no big deal to make mistakes, try not to. If you are with the Philharmonic, your fired. That is a harsh reality for those who have dedicated their lives to perfection. People who are in orchestras do not and cannot make mistakes.
Everyone has the ability to reach the higher standards set by the greats. There are many factors that keep us from that plateau.
How to avoid mistakes? Blood, sweat and tears. If you make a mistake then you don't really know the piece at all.
Advice... If you are a performer, play what you know. Don't take a chance on something you don't have completely down pat. If you are just jamming, keep messing up until you get it right. But don't accept the notion that it is ok. Practice, practice, practice, practice sober.
I have to disagree. In case of obvious blunders, or screwups when playing the tune, I agree. As an artist, one has a concept of what he or she wan't to do. When I don't get what I'm trying for, especially when I improvise, my audience doesn't know (because they can't read my mind) what I'm trying for. I have often walked offstage or ended a number thaniking "My God, that was lame!", only to be congratulated by my bandmembers (or the audience by applaue) saying what an incredible solo or performance I gave. I still feel like I goofed, though. So, I don't believe that there is anyone out there who can detect my mistakes (unless I'm making another futile stab at the fiddle). I DO practice to learn a new tune on occasion, or to explore a new tuning, but the best way, IMHO, to improve is to get out there and perform. |
keaka |
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Mark
Ha`aha`a
USA
1628 Posts |
Posted - 09/20/2008 : 08:47:40 AM
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Gotta chime in on the issue of mistakes-
1) Every single performing musician has clammed on stage. The good ones don't let it bother them. And, more importantly, the good (or just experienced) ones don't telegraph the mistake to the audience by making that "dead-clam-in-da-chowder" face.
2) When I perform, I want to take chances-- my favorite sets are the ones where I walk on stage and improvise. That may mean I'm playing with other musicians who can swing, or it may mean I take stuff I've played a million times and go somewhere else with it.
But it sure as heck means I run the risk of opening a fish market!
Like they say in Buckaroo Banzai, "So what? Beeg Deal!" No one has ever exploded on stage for playing the wrong note.
3) What does that say about practicing? Simple-- in addition to practicing the notes, practice playing "music," with all that it entails: heart, timing, soul, communication, playfulness...
and yeah, practice giggling when ya goof. Just like Led.
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Edited by - Mark on 09/20/2008 08:48:59 AM |
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rendesvous1840
Ha`aha`a
USA
1055 Posts |
Posted - 09/20/2008 : 11:04:05 AM
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I was playing in an open mike one night, and got the 2nd part of the 4th verse mixed in the 3rd verse. Then, when I got to the 4th verse, I realized I had used those word already. I threw out a line that rhymed, but made lttle sense. My older daughter, Karen, turned and gave me a funny look. Later,she said"You forgot the words, didn't you?" I said "Shhhh. Nobody else knows." Nobody else was paying that close of attention, and Karen didn't know what went there, she just new it wasn't what I put there. Playing in a quiter situation once, I lost the words in the 2nd phrase of the song. I stopped, and said "Well, I knew the words yesterday!" It got a good laugh, and one friend suggested I use the joke even if I didn't forget the words.These are all tools we use to recover from errors. You don't throw away your screwdriver when you buy a hammer, right? As was pointed out, the sun rises tomorrow. The reality is, if you get the audience to laugh, dance or sing along, they'll have fun. So if they laugh at my lapses, it works.
Paul |
"A master banjo player isn't the person who can pick the most notes.It's the person who can touch the most hearts." Patrick Costello |
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RJS
Ha`aha`a
1635 Posts |
Posted - 09/20/2008 : 5:34:46 PM
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Hiram,
Mistakes are not the standard in classical venues. If it were Rubenstein, Heiftiz, Rachmaninoff and dozens of others would have been out of jobs way early in their careers.
The standard of perfection is actually relatively new in the history of music performance, one largely brought on by the over-reliance on editing the final "product" brought on by modern production techniques. |
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Trev
Lokahi
United Kingdom
265 Posts |
Posted - 09/22/2008 : 04:04:51 AM
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Yeah, but Classical music isn't like other sorts. In classical music, everything is written down to the nth degree, and any deviation from what is written is WRONG, and that's that. In all other music, variation and improvisation from the performer is not only allowed, it's usually expected.
If anyone can give me the name of a musician in any style who claims that they've never once made a mistake on stage, then I'd be very interested to hear about it, because I've never met one, or heard of one.
If your goal is to play a piece a certain way, and your goal is a certain bunch of notes in a certain order, and it has to be a 'difinitive version', then the only thing for it is loads of practice. And the point about getting it right one day, then messing up the next? Happens all the time to all of us. The trick is not to practice it until you get it right - the trick is to keep practising it until you can't get it wrong. That is the sort of approach a classical player might take.
Someone taking another approach might learn the 'skeleton' of the tune, and not know exactly how they're going to play it until they actually are playing it.
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RJS
Ha`aha`a
1635 Posts |
Posted - 09/22/2008 : 10:19:37 AM
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| Trev, no arguements there - my last post was actually to say that even in classical music, with the greatest performers, mistakes happen and are taken in stride. |
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