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slackkey808
Akahai
USA
50 Posts |
 Posted - 02/01/2009 : 10:10:42 PM
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Ok I don't know if it's just me, but it seems like not many kids around my age like Hawaiian music. I just would like confirmation if that's true, or if I need to get out of the house more. If it is true, why do you guyz think its that way?
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braddah jay
Lokahi
235 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2009 : 11:30:41 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by slackkey808
Ok I don't know if it's just me, but it seems like not many kids around my age like Hawaiian music. I just would like confirmation if that's true, or if I need to get out of the house more. If it is true, why do you guyz think its that way?
First of all which hawaiian music you talkin about? Then you can go from there.To me it's about what we grow up with,I remembah 2-3 days of partying playin music,all da ohana stopping by.Nowadays not too much of those goin around.Technology plays a big part,i-pods,high tech games,and of course da in thing kind of music,as uncle duke calls em,"here today gone tomorrow".Jus play some of dem old songs,you still goin get chicken skin reaction from some people,timeless.Das why keep em goin.K-den |
Edited by - braddah jay on 02/01/2009 11:33:55 PM |
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slackkey808
Akahai
USA
50 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2009 : 12:20:49 AM
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| Any kind Hawaiian music. Slack key, falsetto, oli (I know I don't listen to everything, but some kids don't listen to any). I remember just the other day, I picked my sister up from school, and on the way home, 3-4 cars passed me blasting rap music, so you know what I did? I cranked up Eddie Kamae "E Kiss Kaua" and any other Hawaiian songs I got on my iPod. Today (Super Bowl day) though, it was nice to hear someone playing "Waikiki" sung by Keahiwai I believe, on the radio, but it wasn't a teenager, more like in his mid twenties maybe early thirties (I heard 'em while I was waiting with my girlfriend to pick up sushi in Kane'ohe). Anyway yeah I'm just talking about pretty much any kind Hawaiian (but not Jawaiian). Whatever YOU think is Hawaiian, how many kids do you think LIKE to listen to something on that list (not just listen cuz they're parents or grandparents are playing it on the radio). So far I only know Danny, Peter, the Abrigo's, couple of kids Uncle Duke talked about in another post I saw a long time ago, and that's about all I can think of at the moment. So that's about 8 in however many teenagers are in Hawaii (250,000 just a guess) plus got lots of kids that go to mainland college from Hawaii. |
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wcerto
Ahonui
USA
5052 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2009 : 02:41:05 AM
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Many kids do not like the traditional music of their etchnic heritage. Somehow they think it is just not cool and will get them labeled as a weirdo or something. Many kids that age want to be like a heard of sheep and not stick out in a crowd. A friend once told me that children take every value you have taught them and put those values in a basket for safe keeping. When they get to be a teenager, they take that basket full of values and dump it on the ground. They are trying to become an "individual", to grow and become the person they want to be as an adult. The funny thing is, that when we aren't looking, one by one they start picking up those values. As they encounter life's situations, they find that one or another of those values suddenly become important or become needed to them. The same holds true forthe music and other customs of their cultural background. As they mature, they find comfort in the older stuff and they also become more tolerant of others who do not have the same tastes as they.
Many teenagers do not want to be the nail that is sticking out of the board. Many times the board sticking out of the nail gets hammered back down so it doesn't stand out. Schools are like that. They do not want the students who are outstanding, because that requires more work on behalf of the educators and more money on part of the school boards in order to accommodate those students who are out of the norm for any reason. But you know what, those kids who are the ones who stick up out of the board are the ones who grow to be very successful, productive adults, because they aren't afraid of taking on something that is not popular. They have developed strength of character to do what they believe are the good things, the right things.
There are other young folks out there who like, appreciate and want to play traditional Hawaiian music. I have seen so many videos on You Tube of young Hawaiian people playing `ukulele or guitar (mostly `ukulele). They like to cover today's popular songs and music styles, but if you look at their You Tube channels, you will see videos of traditional Hawaiian music periodically. Ah, there it is. They are starting to pick up those values and put them back in the box. And at least they are playing `ukulele. They have not even dumped all the values on the ground.
But those of you who are young parents, those of you who have babies to raise -- make sure you play either by recordings or by an actual instrument, traditional Hawaiian music. That way it will become the norm for the keiki. It won't be strange to them. That is why the Hawaiian immersion pre-schools do what they do. A great premise to teach the child at an early age.
Martin Pahinui was very sad at one time because he saw the Pahinui mo'opuna playing modern music, hip-hop and rock & roll, Martin told me disgustedly. And I told him to hang on that they will come back to their roots. And they have done so, admirably.
That's what roots are for -- to keep you tied to your foundation, your kumu. They go deep, deep. Even after you cut down a tree, the roots are still there underground, waiting for a bit of nuturing, and they can start sending new growth up through the soil.
Zack - it looks like there are no young folks out there, but they are there. You will meet those who malama the music as you do. Just hang in there.
That is why I think that Lanet's Kanikapila O`ahu is so important. It is so very important for younger folks to see that other young folks take part in these kanikapila, that they see people having GREAT fun, all generations, making music together. If they see it is happening, maybe they will shyly decide to listen in the background. Then next time, they bring their `ukulele. Next time they gonna bring their guitar or whatever. And that way traditional music may start to flourish once again. It will become the norm.
Imua! |
Me ke aloha
Malama pono,
Wanda |
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slipry1
Ha`aha`a
USA
1511 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2009 : 06:22:44 AM
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| Just to remind everyone: asmong others, the Pahinui Brothers & Dennis Kamakahi talk about playing rock while in their teens and getting over it. It's a phase most of us go through as adolescents, then turn to where our souls. I call the pop music business (yes, it's a business) "the Great Maw", because it chews up and spits out artists while collecting a lot of bucks. Teeners, with a lot of hormones flowing and not a lot of sense, flock to this stuff until it gets so bad that there is a revolution against it. It's going on now on the West Coast; kids are picking up banjos, fiddles and guitars and playing old timey string band music much as a lot of us did in the 60's and 70's. When I ask them what inspired them, they usually tell me that what's on the radio is pretty lame. I could go on ranting about this for a long time, but..... |
keaka |
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Russell Letson
`Olu`olu
USA
504 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2009 : 07:07:04 AM
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When I saw Wanda's mention of Martin's reaction to Pahinui kids listening to mainstream pop I had to smile, since I know that Martin (and Bla) were big rock fans when younger and pretty much ignored their dad's music. (They could play it, but left to themselves they played rock.) In fact, just about all the middle-aged Hawaiian players I've interviewed have said that they listened to a lot of pop when they were teenagers. The Kamehameha Schools kids seem to have had a stronger connection to traditional music thanks to the music programs and the efforts of Auntie Nona and others--and also, perhaps, thanks to coming from more tradition-oriented families. One of the repeated stories is of family visits to grandparents or aunts and uncles, where there would be some exposure to and participation in older ways, including music, song, and dance.
Zack, if it's any comfort, it's not very different on the mainland--black kids don't care about the blues (especially rural blues), rural white kids are more likely to play heavy metal than fiddle music on their car radios, and every suburban kid of any color or background wants to be a rapper. It's an unusual subculture that manages to keep its kids focused on the subculture's own kind of music--the European gypsies seem to manage it a little, but I'll bet there are Rom dads and grand-dads complaining about the kids listening to rap instead of Django on their boom-boxes.
But there always seems to be a remnant that returns to (or never leaves) the central tradition, and those are the ones who go back to the elders (or the record collection) and pick it up and eventually pass it along.
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PoiDog
Lokahi
245 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2009 : 08:11:10 AM
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I am one kid  ....maybe one OLD kid, but one kid at heart. I love the more traditional, older style Hawaiian music. But I am still one old kid...My 2 X's used to remind me of that fact...constantly. Das Y dey is da ex's! |
Aloha,
da Poi Dog |
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sm80808
Lokahi
347 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2009 : 08:53:24 AM
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Hey Zack, I can relate with how you feel.
When I was in high school in the late 90's the most popular Hawaiian groups on the radio were Pure Heart/Kapena/Ka'au Crater Boys/etc. I liked them, but I preferred older groups like the Kahauanu Lake Trio/Sunday Manoa/Olomana... I remembering feeling like I was the only one my age who appreciated Hawaiian music.
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slackkey808
Akahai
USA
50 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2009 : 09:34:58 AM
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It's nice to know that there are some others who can relate. What I seem to be getting from everyone is that as far as music goes for teenagers (and maybe everything) it's about fitting in with everyone else? But why do you think that's so. I mean I can tell you personally that I was so into slack key my senior year that I left my guitar in taropatch. Now I get one guitar taropatch, one C6, one Bb and a Fender in standard in case I want to attempt to be like Stevie Ray Vaughn. I'm 19 and the majority here are some artists that I listen to all the time in my grandparents car (when I'm driving) with my iPod plugged in...
Ledward Kaapana
Ozzie Kotani
Dennis Kamakahi
Eddie Kamae
Hui Ohana
Olomana
Peter Moon
Gabby Pahinui etc. I got other stuff on it from when I was a freshmen, but even back in 7th and 8th grade I always really liked Hawaiian music, just never knew how much was out there.
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wcerto
Ahonui
USA
5052 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2009 : 12:14:33 PM
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Yeah, when Martin told me about his kids playing rock & roll, I laughed so hard. I asked him, what about Cane Fire? And Gabby listened to rock & roll, too. After all, didn't he kakaroach the intro to Shambala from 3 Dog Night? And Martin and Cyril and Bla and Phillip will tell you that Gabby told them play what you like, but never forget your roots. Remember you are Hawaiian and keep the Hawaiian music in your heart, also.
I would like to hear Peter. Jr.'s opinion on this. He is younger still than Zack. PM, Jr. come outta the cracks and join in. Why did you come to traditional Hawaiian music? Was it because of your father's fame? A lot of your father's stuff was cutting edge stuff, if you ask me, but he did what he did at the time that was right for it and he got a lot of his contemporaries to pay attention to Hawaiian music. When you see the video of PM, Jr.'s dad jamming with Gabby on Waialae and then heare him sing Island love, you can see how he brought a whole bunch of young folks back to the roots, back to the piko.
Lanet - I would also like to hear how your very young family came to be interested in the music. You can tell Timi and Emily are really grooving on it, but do they want the Jawaiian and hip-hop, too? Does Quin know and understand the music or does he just want to have fun like his brother and sister do? What would have taken kids Timi & Emily's age to learn the music?
I can certainly say that if children are learning hula and belong to a halau, they really are learning a good foundation and really learn a lot about the traditional music. |
Me ke aloha
Malama pono,
Wanda |
Edited by - wcerto on 02/03/2009 02:00:07 AM |
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P.M. JR.
Akahai
USA
50 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2009 : 5:42:25 PM
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Aloha Aunty Wanda,
I play Music because I enjoy it and because it's a craft which can exude a plethora of feeling. Traditional Hawaiian Music is chanting, ipu, etc... What WE call "Traditional Hawaiian Music" today was in fact the untraditional (but progressive) music of its hayday.
The amount of fame my Dad has/has had throughout his career hasn't influenced me. Knowing first hand what he could do was more than enough to spur me on until I started my own love affair with music.
To acknowledge the past with styles and tools of the present and future is how "Hawaiian Music" or all music progresses as a genre.
I acknowledge my Dad's music; It's my greatest inspiration but when learning a song I don't obsess over every note. What would that prove? No one can touch Gabby, Atta, Sonny, or my Dad. I makes me sad to see Youtube videos of people copying songs like Pandanus and Kawika note for note because they'll never evoke the emotions/mana as intended by the original artist(s).
Example:
Pandanus (Very Very Very Very Very Very (too) Similar)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5o6LDrDlx_4
Pandanus (Acknowledges Peter Moon but with individuality and class)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MyKJQZ4H5Jg
(Fast Forward to 4:45)
ANYWAY... the problem with this Jawaiian crap is that it doesn't retain any remnants or feeling of the previous generations.
O well...just my 2 cents lol
ZACK! Let's jam soon! Bring the Fender. I like the standard tuning just as much as Slack Key if not more.
Shootz XP
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Peter W.K. Moon |
Edited by - P.M. JR. on 02/02/2009 7:30:25 PM |
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slackkey808
Akahai
USA
50 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2009 : 8:54:20 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by P.M. JR.
Aloha Aunty Wanda,
I play Music because I enjoy it and because it's a craft which can exude a plethora of feeling. Traditional Hawaiian Music is chanting, ipu, etc... What WE call "Traditional Hawaiian Music" today was in fact the untraditional (but progressive) music of its hayday.
The amount of fame my Dad has/has had throughout his career hasn't influenced me. Knowing first hand what he could do was more than enough to spur me on until I started my own love affair with music.
To acknowledge the past with styles and tools of the present and future is how "Hawaiian Music" or all music progresses as a genre.
I acknowledge my Dad's music; It's my greatest inspiration but when learning a song I don't obsess over every note. What would that prove? No one can touch Gabby, Atta, Sonny, or my Dad. I makes me sad to see Youtube videos of people copying songs like Pandanus and Kawika note for note because they'll never evoke the emotions/mana as intended by the original artist(s).
Example:
Pandanus (Very Very Very Very Very Very (too) Similar)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5o6LDrDlx_4
Pandanus (Acknowledges Peter Moon but with individuality and class)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MyKJQZ4H5Jg
(Fast Forward to 4:45)
ANYWAY... the problem with this Jawaiian crap is that it doesn't retain any remnants or feeling of the previous generations.
O well...just my 2 cents lol
ZACK! Let's jam soon! Bring the Fender. I like the standard tuning just as much as Slack Key if not more.
Shootz XP
Hey Peter, nice to get your input on this subject. I don't know when we can, I was gonna tell Aunty Lanet that we should probably have Feb kanikapila at Doug Fitch's house. That would be on the 21rst if it happens at all. Otherwise, I think I'm gonna see Uncle Ozzie this weekend so maybe you could come by, I'll be sure to bring it if I know you're coming. |
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wcerto
Ahonui
USA
5052 Posts |
Posted - 02/03/2009 : 02:15:41 AM
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My youngest daughter (relax, Ed - she is too old for PM, Jr. or Zack) is one of the only kids I know who when she was a teeanger, could care less what the other kids thought about the things she enjoyed. Her musical tastes as especially varieddddddddddddddddddddddddd. Not so much now is it unusual because she has "grown up", being that she is a grown adult out on her own and it is "ok" to be an "individual". But in jr. high and high school she loved classicial music, especially Beethoven, she loved singing in the a capella chir, singing all those madrigals at Christmas time, she liked opera, broadway musicals but then she liked Tori Amos and some of the other more contemporary stuff. She plays violin. When she was in elementary school and decided to take up the violin I thought Auryte, she is going to be my down home fiddle player. NOT. She never learned "fiddle" music and had no desire to. It was in her etchnic background, but I guess that is one thing she did notpick up to put in her basket; or maybe the thing she picked up and put back in her basket was that she was free to enjoy whatever music she liked.
But at least she knows who is Iz and Makaha Sons and Brothers Cazimero and such. I bet there are not very many 20-soomethings over here who would know. And she even can pronounce Iz's name!
I have a suggestion - look at the videos on you tube and when you see a young person playing Hawaiian music, contact that person through e-mail to see if they like jam. You and Zack may be the leaders of bringing a whole new generation of young people to the music, you have fun at it yourself and you malama the music. |
Me ke aloha
Malama pono,
Wanda |
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Kaiulani
Akahai
77 Posts |
Posted - 02/03/2009 : 03:25:37 AM
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Aloha Kakou,
This also carries over into hula. I have had many kumu hula come to me in tears. They tell me that many younger Hawaiians do not want to carry on the traditional ways. In Rochester, I have had many Hawaiians come to me to learn their culture (now they are over 30 years old). I was not born Hawaiian in this life time but I have carried on the culture since I was 4 years old...long time. Kimo & I have 6 children. They have been immersed in Hawaiian music, oli and hula since birth. They all have their moments of loving it... and then turn their backs on it because it is mom & dad's "thing". Except my youngest, Hanalei Mahina, she chants, plays ipu and loves the hula! I agree that we as adults need to hold on and keep trying. The roots are there...keep nurturing them...they do NOT die.
Me Ke Aloha,
Ka'iulani
www.GalleryKauai.com |
Me Ke Aloha,
Ka'iulani
www.GalleryKauai.com |
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abrigoohana
Lokahi
271 Posts |
Posted - 02/03/2009 : 11:05:03 AM
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Aloha Taropatch Ohana,
Wanda, I was moved to tears with your "basket story", I just loved it so much. You asked how my children became (and continue to be) inspired by traditional Hawaiian music. Well, let me start by saying that although I have Hawaiian blood, my parents moved to the mainland shortly after my birth, so I grew up away from the language, culture, and music. On special occasions we might be lucky enough to have a family member send us a care package of Hawaiian food. That was the only time I heard Hawaiian words in my youth (lau lau, poi, lomi salmon, kalua pig).
My husband grew up here on O'ahu. He loves Hawaiian music, but even he wasn't into the old school songs until our children started playing them, but he did enjoy Kapena, Pandanus Club, and Olomana in his youth.
The children, their first songs were mostly hapa haole music, Little Grass Shack, Beach Bum Boogie... then we met Uncle George Kahumoku. He fell in love with the children and gave us an open invitation to his show, the Master's of Hawaiian Slack Key Guitar. The first night we went, Uncle Led was the guest. My children have never looked back. I kind of think it's born into them, because once they saw and heard the traditional Hawaiian music, they just started to blossom. Zack you must be the same way, it's like it runs in your blood and your very soul.
When Timi first started to play slack key, I used to just sit there and cry. I felt like he was another musician reincarnated or something, I just couldn't understand it. He continues to be hugely inspired by Uncle Led and Uncle George, but also enjoys Jerry Santos and a select few others. Then one day Emily decided to sing I Kona... my husband and I just looked at each other with our jaws on the floor. She met Uncle Kamaka Fernandez, and has been his loving fan ever since. Through Kamaka, she met Uncle Richard Ho'opi'i, and Auntie Genoa Keawe. Quinn has always sat with his brother and sister and played something. He started off with percussion, then moved to pakini bass last year. It's hard for him because he's so little, his hands can't even reach the top frets on his uke bass. Even so, he has been on the stage every time, done every radio station interview, and he's so into the music. He walks around the house singing Koke'e, Hi'ilawe, Hene Hene Kou 'Aka, you name it.
Even now I often wonder if God sent them into the wrong family, or even the wrong place in time. If they were born into a family like the Pahinui's, Ka'apana's, Lim's, Keale's or the Keawe's, they would be in much more capable hands. How could these children come into a family where there was NO music? It's just how it is, I can't question it cause I'm too darn busy being GRATEFUL for it.
There is pressure though... people sometimes say things like "when will they start writing music instead of playing the old school stuff?" or "they should play more modern songs or other stuff so they have more cross over potential." I say, they play what they feel like learning. I say, they will write songs (like Zack does), when they're ready.
My children will often choose to sit with adults rather than other children. It has nothing to do with snobbery or anything like that. They just prefer to spend time with their mentors, no matter what their age. To you Zack, I say you are a gift. If you play the music, you will inspire them. Just play it, love it, and let them come to it in their own good time. Main thing is, you play what you love.
A Hui Hou, Lanet and the Abrigo Ohana
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braddah jay
Lokahi
235 Posts |
Posted - 02/03/2009 : 11:24:35 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by P.M. JR.
No one can touch Gabby, Atta, Sonny, or my Dad. I makes me sad to see Youtube videos of people copying songs like Pandanus and Kawika note for note because they'll never evoke the emotions/mana as intended by the original artist(s).
Example:
Pandanus (Very Very Very Very Very Very (too) Similar)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5o6LDrDlx_4
Pandanus (Acknowledges Peter Moon but with individuality and class)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MyKJQZ4H5Jg
(Fast Forward to 4:45)
.
O well...just my 2 cents lol
Eh peter,remembah dis is my 2 cents worth.You say it saddens you wen someone plays a song note for note,because it cannot evoke emotion and mana as intended by the original artist's.Those two performances were an acknowledgment of what that song and your dad's talent meant to them,one say's it while performing it,the other say's it by learning it "note for note".In either case they practiced till they felt they had it right.So what you see as sad I see as credibility to your dads influence in other musicians such as yourself.Trying to evoke the same emotion and mana? No,moa like look I like dat song so much I goin play em for you to listen.I think the one who played note for note,put moa time in.To me das one compliment,but dat's just my 2 cents lol.
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